The IMAX screen is currently closed, and looks like it will reopen with Venom (though tickets are not on sale yet). Don’t know if it that’s enough time to add a new projector (since they already did the sound, seating, and interior design upgrades), or if it’s just other touch ups.
I saw the renovated theater today. I expect there is still some exterior work to go, as the Loews signage has been taken down but just put a cheap looking AMC banner hanging in its place.
The seats are different than other AMC recliners, more of a half recliners as it doesn’t go as far back nor provide all the leg room (this was the let down with the seats for me) of other recliners I’ve seen. The back warmer was nice, but I wish there was another setting, as they just had a high and low and I turned it on a few times in the movie but found even on the low setting it felt a bit too warm after a couple minutes and I would then turn it off (had it on high during the previews and that got way too high to me).
They also took masking away from Kips Bay when they renovated it (except for the IMAX, which was always an unmasked scope screen and didn’t get updated seating). That theater has a mix of aspect ratios, with the larger screens being scope and the smaller downstairs screens being flat (personally unmasked pillarboxed flat movies on a scope screen bothers me more than letterboxed scope movies). For the IMAX I’ve seen both pollarboxing or cropping used for movies taller than scope.
Typically AMC’s policy after renovations is to keep the price the same for between 18 months to two years in order to attract audiences to the theater, and then raise the price up to two dollars (though if you have their A List subscription service, showings at the more expensive theaters are covered with no surcharge).
For instance, I believe Kips Bay (which completed its renovations right around Christmas 2016) still charges the same, but 84st (one of the first to renovate back in 2013) has charged more for years now and must be a very successful theater based on the crowds I see there.
It wasn’t just that showing, I went on Friday here and indeed they kept the lights off for the entire intermission (I’m guessing they programmed the DCP to bring down the lights at the overture and not raise them till the credits, pretty standard for movies these days and didn’t feel it was worth mentioning to the staff, but would have been nice if they went extra step).
I had heard from people who saw it Thursday in digital IMAX that it would be in roadshow format with no trailers, overture, and an intermission so I knew what to expect and got up for a few minutes. But I think a number of the audience members were perplexed (I did have to explain about the overture and intermission to my friend who had never seen that with a movie before) and just stayed in their seats quietly, expecting it to begin again any moment.
Still, despite that one little odd presentation quirk I really enjoyed 2001 here, I had never seen the film on the big screen before and found there was a lot to appreciate with that.
Hi Bill, I saw 2001 on Friday at the Kips Bay. While I had seen the film quite a few times before, I had never seen it theatrically before and getting the extra detail and richness of color than you could find in home viewings was a pleasure. I didn’t notice anything off in that sequence you mentioned, but did notice a few shots which looked poor in the film, didn’t distract from about 98% of the movie looking great (and I figured if anything there could be issues inherent in the source elements of those shots).
Also saw The Dark Knight at this theater tonight, and even as good as 2001 it couldn’t quite compare (though I had seen the film in a regular screen theatrically when it first came out, and again a number of times at home since). A bit of dust and I noticed a hair in one shot, but this was either a new or very well preserved print, did notice a few seconds of shakiness twice (in the opening scene and Hong Kong sequence) which may have just been with this screening, but otherwise the image was rocksteady, the native IMAX footage was of course the jaw dropping highlight, but even the 35mm DMR material had some incredible looking images. Like 2001, there were no trailers (makes sense, 2001 is being done in roadshow format, and what 15/70 IMAX trailers would be available) in both cases I think a couple audience members were expecting those and didn’t get in till around 15 minutes into the films.
Yes, it has been announced that IMAX film print showings of 2001 are based on the unrestored 70mm version, and just photochemical blow ups to IMAX rather than going through the IMAX remastering process most Hollywood releases do. I’m pretty sure it will be shown letterbox in 2.20 aspect ratio given there is no material for an expanded aspect ratio version (if you want to see the screen filled, either the IMAX sequences in Dark Knight, or the currently playing Documentary Pandas, will do so).
The digital IMAX showings of 2001 though will be based on a new 4K restoration though. Personally I want to see it at Kips Bay or AMC Empire as I’m interested in what the remaster looks like.
Though it’s important to note it’s the E Walk IMAX VR location which closed. Still, from what I’ve seen, I don’t think this one does great business either.
I saw the Dolby Cinema tonight, it is a scope screen like the Empire one. Screen isn’t that large though (I believe contractually they have to be smaller than the IMAX in a theater with both formats, and the IMAX screen here seems to me to be the smallest of the Manhattan sites), I would imagine the former Loews screen at Lincoln Square will be bigger once those Dolby Cinema renovations are complete.
Traditionally a limited release means less than 600 domestic theaters (and I think the theater count matters more than the cinema it plays in, many NYC theaters including Lincoln Square of course play both wide and limited releases). Though in this age of the biggest blockbusters getting over 4000 theaters, I have seen some unofficially move that mark to 1000 theaters.
Bigjoe59- I saw The Seagull here a couple weeks ago, and was a bit funny to see the giant G rating on the 2001 poster outside, cause even while it is far from a graphic film, not what people associate with the G rating today.
But it’s a mix of there being no PG-13 rating until the mid 1980s and the MPAA starting to get much stricter during the 1990s that lead to questionable ratings one finds on some older films (as some examples of the changes look at the PG rated All the President’s Men which has language that would trigger an R now, or the formerly G rated Wizard of Oz getting a PG when it was resubmitted for the 3D re-release several years ago).
Bigjoe59- I do agree with others that this discussion belonged on the Orpheum page, but to reiterate, I am pretty sure it was issues with the showing you had and it’s very easy for the manager to just say the issue is with the movie and not them (and from my experience AMC is definitely not the best at running that theater, I’ve seen issues with their restrooms as well as incorrectly setting the masking to flat on scope films so that the sides of the image were cut off, etc).
Also, did you happen to see Solo in screen 7 (the largest screen downstairs)? I saw Ocean’s 8 there this weekend, and while it didn’t experiment with the darker levels like Solo did which could be a real problem if the calibration is off, it did seem a bit darker than the previews for the movie and there was a shot where it seemed like the audience was clearly supposed to read what a character had written down but I couldn’t make it out as the image was too dark.
Whereas, in addition to the IMAX at Lincoln Square, I saw Solo a second time in the regular DCP at Union Square, and though it naturally lacked some detail compared to IMAX laser projection, I again didn’t have any issues with brightness levels.
Here’s an article about Solo cinematography/projection issues.
Basically, yes they were experimenting with darker cinematography, but nothing that hasn’t been done before (The Godfather is specifically pointed to). The problem is that if a theater’s equipment isn’t great or calibration is off by even 10%, it can lose all the proper shadow details and look bad. The argument among professionals still seems to be that cinematographers shouldn’t just limit themselves to “safe” lighting levels in order to be more error proof and lower the quality of the work (as I said I thought it looked very nice on this theater’s IMAX, and one of the things you pay for with a premium ticket is better projection equipment and I believe the screen is constantly calibrated remotely by IMAX’s technical staff).
I did see Solo on this theater’s IMAX screen, and while it was dark at times (notably in the first act), I didn’t find it to be overly so and could name plenty of darker movies. I have seen some complaints about that as well, so I think it comes to a mix of artistic choices with the movie, as well as how good and properly calibrated a theater’s projector is (IMAX laser is a high dynamic range system which boosts the contrast and able to handle black levels, the Orpheum feels outdated and not the best maintained in many areas and I can imagine the darker scenes looking muddy or hard to see there- I recall the image for The Mountain Between Us looking sorta washed out there for instance).
Peter- I’ve heard from someone else who saw 2001 yesterday that there is a 2 line scratch down the middle of the screen for much of the third act. Certainly doesn’t sound like the ones from negative used to make the new prints, or what was in the first days it was showing, and that’s unfortunate (though also the risk run the longer a print has been playing).
Personally, I would be in favor of fixing scratches on the negative, but since they are advertising this as an “unrestored” re-release, I do see how it goes against that idea. If you look at home media versions of many older films (usually not A-list titles which do get restored), you can often find dirt or small scratches from the print used for the home transfer still there.
The team preparing this version of 2001 decided to keep some tears from the original negative, instead of repairing them, as they felt it would be more authentic that way.
Obviously now that it’s been showing for a bit, new scratches may have appeared, but even a flawless print and showing of this release will have those issues.
The no masking is annoying (even if Kips Bay and some other theaters are the same), but I love this theater otherwise. Great seating, projection (this is the highlight every screen is laser projection and looks noticeably better), sound, and concessions menu. I also think their film selection has improved now with the closing of Lincoln Plaza and the Sunshine.
But there must be huge attendance issues, probably cause of location (though personally I don’t mind the walk from the Carnegie Hall subway stop) or marketing. I’ve been there around 7 times now and never had a near full screening and twice I was the only person there.
I believe City Cinemas charges extra for 70mm, while AMC charges standard price. By the way, pretty sure it was just Lincoln Square (where I saw it) and Village East which played Murder on the Orient Express in 70mm, but this theater has played all the recent 70mm releases from Warner Bros
@leowtyx, it really seems to come down to the movie. But at least what AMC/IMAX seemed to do with Thor, Star Wars, Pacific Rim, and now Infinity War is all 3D showings at Lincoln Square, all 2D at Penn Station, and mix in 2D and 3D showings at Empire 25 and Kips Bay.
I think there must be a bug or crash with AMC. I was looking at tickets either to Pacific Rim IMAX or Isle of Dogs tonight, and every ticket service wasn’t working (Fandango, Atom, AMC’s own site), and not just this theater, but also checked the AMC Empire and Kips Bay.
@alpinedownhiller- I believe it was said Infinity War will be finished in 4K (makes sense since it was shot on IMAX digital cameras). Though as you point out, all IMAX lasers DCPs are 4K, using upscaling when a film’s regular DCP is 2K.
Well, I could see them adding in IMAX 2D showings later in the run like they did with The Last Jedi here, since it should hold IMAX screens until Solo or at least Deadpool 2.
Going by Fandango, it looks like there will be a fair mix of IMAX 3D and 2D screenings in NYC, with it being 3D here, 2D at Penn Station, and alternating showings at Kips Bay and AMC Empire, and I think giving a range of options is better than the just 2D and just 3D IMAX releases they often do.
Yeah, I saw Hostiles here last weekend as well. The credit card kiosk was broken so one needed to use the box office window, the screen (theater 4) was absolutely tiny, yet due to older, cheaper projection equipment still had some visible pixelization (whereas a new 4K projector will look gorgeously sharp even on far bigger screens), the showing was done in a closed caption format (perhaps to fit the older audience, but I found it kinda distracting and as far as I could tell was not readily advertised for that format when I was looking up showtimes). As well as usual issues with uncomfortable seats in a well over two hour movie, and patrons who snore or have loud cell phone rings during the movie.
I’ve seen a lot of great films here, and certainly feel bad for people who are going to be out of a job, but it was a good last screening as it reinforced idea I already had that in many ways it’s time for this place to close.
The IMAX screen is currently closed, and looks like it will reopen with Venom (though tickets are not on sale yet). Don’t know if it that’s enough time to add a new projector (since they already did the sound, seating, and interior design upgrades), or if it’s just other touch ups.
I saw the renovated theater today. I expect there is still some exterior work to go, as the Loews signage has been taken down but just put a cheap looking AMC banner hanging in its place.
The seats are different than other AMC recliners, more of a half recliners as it doesn’t go as far back nor provide all the leg room (this was the let down with the seats for me) of other recliners I’ve seen. The back warmer was nice, but I wish there was another setting, as they just had a high and low and I turned it on a few times in the movie but found even on the low setting it felt a bit too warm after a couple minutes and I would then turn it off (had it on high during the previews and that got way too high to me).
They also took masking away from Kips Bay when they renovated it (except for the IMAX, which was always an unmasked scope screen and didn’t get updated seating). That theater has a mix of aspect ratios, with the larger screens being scope and the smaller downstairs screens being flat (personally unmasked pillarboxed flat movies on a scope screen bothers me more than letterboxed scope movies). For the IMAX I’ve seen both pollarboxing or cropping used for movies taller than scope.
Typically AMC’s policy after renovations is to keep the price the same for between 18 months to two years in order to attract audiences to the theater, and then raise the price up to two dollars (though if you have their A List subscription service, showings at the more expensive theaters are covered with no surcharge).
For instance, I believe Kips Bay (which completed its renovations right around Christmas 2016) still charges the same, but 84st (one of the first to renovate back in 2013) has charged more for years now and must be a very successful theater based on the crowds I see there.
It wasn’t just that showing, I went on Friday here and indeed they kept the lights off for the entire intermission (I’m guessing they programmed the DCP to bring down the lights at the overture and not raise them till the credits, pretty standard for movies these days and didn’t feel it was worth mentioning to the staff, but would have been nice if they went extra step).
I had heard from people who saw it Thursday in digital IMAX that it would be in roadshow format with no trailers, overture, and an intermission so I knew what to expect and got up for a few minutes. But I think a number of the audience members were perplexed (I did have to explain about the overture and intermission to my friend who had never seen that with a movie before) and just stayed in their seats quietly, expecting it to begin again any moment.
Still, despite that one little odd presentation quirk I really enjoyed 2001 here, I had never seen the film on the big screen before and found there was a lot to appreciate with that.
Hi Bill, I saw 2001 on Friday at the Kips Bay. While I had seen the film quite a few times before, I had never seen it theatrically before and getting the extra detail and richness of color than you could find in home viewings was a pleasure. I didn’t notice anything off in that sequence you mentioned, but did notice a few shots which looked poor in the film, didn’t distract from about 98% of the movie looking great (and I figured if anything there could be issues inherent in the source elements of those shots).
Also saw The Dark Knight at this theater tonight, and even as good as 2001 it couldn’t quite compare (though I had seen the film in a regular screen theatrically when it first came out, and again a number of times at home since). A bit of dust and I noticed a hair in one shot, but this was either a new or very well preserved print, did notice a few seconds of shakiness twice (in the opening scene and Hong Kong sequence) which may have just been with this screening, but otherwise the image was rocksteady, the native IMAX footage was of course the jaw dropping highlight, but even the 35mm DMR material had some incredible looking images. Like 2001, there were no trailers (makes sense, 2001 is being done in roadshow format, and what 15/70 IMAX trailers would be available) in both cases I think a couple audience members were expecting those and didn’t get in till around 15 minutes into the films.
Yes, it has been announced that IMAX film print showings of 2001 are based on the unrestored 70mm version, and just photochemical blow ups to IMAX rather than going through the IMAX remastering process most Hollywood releases do. I’m pretty sure it will be shown letterbox in 2.20 aspect ratio given there is no material for an expanded aspect ratio version (if you want to see the screen filled, either the IMAX sequences in Dark Knight, or the currently playing Documentary Pandas, will do so).
The digital IMAX showings of 2001 though will be based on a new 4K restoration though. Personally I want to see it at Kips Bay or AMC Empire as I’m interested in what the remaster looks like.
Though it’s important to note it’s the E Walk IMAX VR location which closed. Still, from what I’ve seen, I don’t think this one does great business either.
I saw the Dolby Cinema tonight, it is a scope screen like the Empire one. Screen isn’t that large though (I believe contractually they have to be smaller than the IMAX in a theater with both formats, and the IMAX screen here seems to me to be the smallest of the Manhattan sites), I would imagine the former Loews screen at Lincoln Square will be bigger once those Dolby Cinema renovations are complete.
The IMAX screen will also be hosting 15/70 film showings of 2001 on the week of August 24. Which explains why Dark Knight was limited to once a day
Traditionally a limited release means less than 600 domestic theaters (and I think the theater count matters more than the cinema it plays in, many NYC theaters including Lincoln Square of course play both wide and limited releases). Though in this age of the biggest blockbusters getting over 4000 theaters, I have seen some unofficially move that mark to 1000 theaters.
Bigjoe59- I saw The Seagull here a couple weeks ago, and was a bit funny to see the giant G rating on the 2001 poster outside, cause even while it is far from a graphic film, not what people associate with the G rating today.
But it’s a mix of there being no PG-13 rating until the mid 1980s and the MPAA starting to get much stricter during the 1990s that lead to questionable ratings one finds on some older films (as some examples of the changes look at the PG rated All the President’s Men which has language that would trigger an R now, or the formerly G rated Wizard of Oz getting a PG when it was resubmitted for the 3D re-release several years ago).
Bigjoe59- I do agree with others that this discussion belonged on the Orpheum page, but to reiterate, I am pretty sure it was issues with the showing you had and it’s very easy for the manager to just say the issue is with the movie and not them (and from my experience AMC is definitely not the best at running that theater, I’ve seen issues with their restrooms as well as incorrectly setting the masking to flat on scope films so that the sides of the image were cut off, etc).
Also, did you happen to see Solo in screen 7 (the largest screen downstairs)? I saw Ocean’s 8 there this weekend, and while it didn’t experiment with the darker levels like Solo did which could be a real problem if the calibration is off, it did seem a bit darker than the previews for the movie and there was a shot where it seemed like the audience was clearly supposed to read what a character had written down but I couldn’t make it out as the image was too dark.
Whereas, in addition to the IMAX at Lincoln Square, I saw Solo a second time in the regular DCP at Union Square, and though it naturally lacked some detail compared to IMAX laser projection, I again didn’t have any issues with brightness levels.
http://www.indiewire.com/2018/05/solo-star-a-wars-story-theatre-projection-problems-bradford-young-1201969989/
Here’s an article about Solo cinematography/projection issues.
Basically, yes they were experimenting with darker cinematography, but nothing that hasn’t been done before (The Godfather is specifically pointed to). The problem is that if a theater’s equipment isn’t great or calibration is off by even 10%, it can lose all the proper shadow details and look bad. The argument among professionals still seems to be that cinematographers shouldn’t just limit themselves to “safe” lighting levels in order to be more error proof and lower the quality of the work (as I said I thought it looked very nice on this theater’s IMAX, and one of the things you pay for with a premium ticket is better projection equipment and I believe the screen is constantly calibrated remotely by IMAX’s technical staff).
I did see Solo on this theater’s IMAX screen, and while it was dark at times (notably in the first act), I didn’t find it to be overly so and could name plenty of darker movies. I have seen some complaints about that as well, so I think it comes to a mix of artistic choices with the movie, as well as how good and properly calibrated a theater’s projector is (IMAX laser is a high dynamic range system which boosts the contrast and able to handle black levels, the Orpheum feels outdated and not the best maintained in many areas and I can imagine the darker scenes looking muddy or hard to see there- I recall the image for The Mountain Between Us looking sorta washed out there for instance).
Peter- I’ve heard from someone else who saw 2001 yesterday that there is a 2 line scratch down the middle of the screen for much of the third act. Certainly doesn’t sound like the ones from negative used to make the new prints, or what was in the first days it was showing, and that’s unfortunate (though also the risk run the longer a print has been playing).
Personally, I would be in favor of fixing scratches on the negative, but since they are advertising this as an “unrestored” re-release, I do see how it goes against that idea. If you look at home media versions of many older films (usually not A-list titles which do get restored), you can often find dirt or small scratches from the print used for the home transfer still there.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/11/movies/2001-a-space-odyssey-christopher-nolan-cannes.html
The team preparing this version of 2001 decided to keep some tears from the original negative, instead of repairing them, as they felt it would be more authentic that way.
Obviously now that it’s been showing for a bit, new scratches may have appeared, but even a flawless print and showing of this release will have those issues.
The no masking is annoying (even if Kips Bay and some other theaters are the same), but I love this theater otherwise. Great seating, projection (this is the highlight every screen is laser projection and looks noticeably better), sound, and concessions menu. I also think their film selection has improved now with the closing of Lincoln Plaza and the Sunshine.
But there must be huge attendance issues, probably cause of location (though personally I don’t mind the walk from the Carnegie Hall subway stop) or marketing. I’ve been there around 7 times now and never had a near full screening and twice I was the only person there.
I believe City Cinemas charges extra for 70mm, while AMC charges standard price. By the way, pretty sure it was just Lincoln Square (where I saw it) and Village East which played Murder on the Orient Express in 70mm, but this theater has played all the recent 70mm releases from Warner Bros
@leowtyx, it really seems to come down to the movie. But at least what AMC/IMAX seemed to do with Thor, Star Wars, Pacific Rim, and now Infinity War is all 3D showings at Lincoln Square, all 2D at Penn Station, and mix in 2D and 3D showings at Empire 25 and Kips Bay.
I think there must be a bug or crash with AMC. I was looking at tickets either to Pacific Rim IMAX or Isle of Dogs tonight, and every ticket service wasn’t working (Fandango, Atom, AMC’s own site), and not just this theater, but also checked the AMC Empire and Kips Bay.
@alpinedownhiller- I believe it was said Infinity War will be finished in 4K (makes sense since it was shot on IMAX digital cameras). Though as you point out, all IMAX lasers DCPs are 4K, using upscaling when a film’s regular DCP is 2K.
Well, I could see them adding in IMAX 2D showings later in the run like they did with The Last Jedi here, since it should hold IMAX screens until Solo or at least Deadpool 2.
Going by Fandango, it looks like there will be a fair mix of IMAX 3D and 2D screenings in NYC, with it being 3D here, 2D at Penn Station, and alternating showings at Kips Bay and AMC Empire, and I think giving a range of options is better than the just 2D and just 3D IMAX releases they often do.
Yeah, I saw Hostiles here last weekend as well. The credit card kiosk was broken so one needed to use the box office window, the screen (theater 4) was absolutely tiny, yet due to older, cheaper projection equipment still had some visible pixelization (whereas a new 4K projector will look gorgeously sharp even on far bigger screens), the showing was done in a closed caption format (perhaps to fit the older audience, but I found it kinda distracting and as far as I could tell was not readily advertised for that format when I was looking up showtimes). As well as usual issues with uncomfortable seats in a well over two hour movie, and patrons who snore or have loud cell phone rings during the movie.
I’ve seen a lot of great films here, and certainly feel bad for people who are going to be out of a job, but it was a good last screening as it reinforced idea I already had that in many ways it’s time for this place to close.