LARGE_screen_format: Responding to the relevant parts of your post on the “Odeon North Greenwich” page dated 2nd July 2018…
If I’m not mistaken UCI Wycombe 6 had identical seats as those you mention from the good ole days at The Empire, Leicester Square and I agree they were super comfy.
The only auditorium photo I can find of this cinema in its original state is one uploaded to Cinema Treasures. Very difficult to tell!
However, there is a photo available of another mid-80s CIC auditorium, namely the old Empire 3, which provides a better view of its seating; these seats do seem to bare some resemblance in form to the American Seating Company seats that were in the old Empire 1, although they have a headrest section.
Perhaps, then, those installed at High Wycombe were a similar model to those in the old Empire 1.
I was really annoyed when they were replaced with inferior seats some years later but could understand the decision to replace rather than refurbish due to cost implications.
Are these the ones that were installed for “the filmworks” overhaul? I assume the stadia was built then also?
I guess at that point the path of least resistance was to “skip” the old and replace.
If that’s how that auditorium looks today then it really needs a makeover—the seats are sagging and the carpet looks like it’s seen better days! (Maybe wet cleaning would be sufficient.)
Alas, the American Seating Company sold its “Architectural Fixed Seating” business to the Irwin Seating Company. Of the American Seating Company’s auditorium seating product lines, the “Stellar” series is in their catalogue, but one might imagine that there might be implications in terms of spare parts availablity for older seats. Now if only I could find “Empire 1”-type (“1960 Comfort Deluxe mode” according to a post on Cinema Treasures by theatreofvarieties) seats on eBay…
LARGE_screen_format: AFAIK the TCL Chinese Theatre IMAX auditorium doesn’t conform to the basic IMAX geometry requirements in that the auditorium depth exceeds the screen width.
(“Back of an envelope” calculation: 23 rows deep x assume 4ft. per row = 92ft. [i.e. almost ~94ft. screen width!] front-to-back distance required for the seating alone—no space for the central gangway nor between the screen and front row!)
A quick look at a photo of the IMAX Melbourne auditorium reveals that the rows are widely spaced.
“Back of an envelope” calculation: If the auditorium depth = screen width and the first row is 0.35x screen width from the screen, per classic IMAX requirements, this leaves about 68ft. depth for the seating. There are 12 rows, so this works out at slightly less than 5.7ft row spacing. Taking these assumptions further, were the row spacing reduced to 4ft., then this would enable around 200 extra seats.
(Hmm, except for the slightly tacky red backlit Cineworld “stars” on the sidewalls.)
360° photos of the foyer (one taken from upper vestibule, the other from the far end), Screen 1 and Screen 2 can be seen on Squaremeal’s website, under the “Virtual Tour” section towards the bottom of the page (“Room List” at the top right of the photo view area is used to select the desired shot.)
In the photo of Screen 1, the yellow upholstered door with “porthole” is still in place!
“Cineworld London Venues” — photos of the LSQ IMAX, O2 Superscreen, Cineworld Wembley and Wandsworth.)
There are photos of the 4DX auditorium in the “carousel” at the top of the page, and if it is available to book, it’s perhaps amusing to imagine a corporate event being ruined by rogue use of the 4DX environmental effects. ;–)
Photos of the former Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square Screens 4/5 are available in Eomac’s literature in the PDF linked to from the linked page.
The new stadia do seem to have quite an improved rake.
I can’t see more than 3 sidewall speakers in the “new” Screen 2, whereas the former Screen 4 had 4—although the front one may be washed out.
Zappomatic: How does the new Lino Sonego seating compare to the previous? (AFAIK from Seating Concepts.) Is the picture/sound quality up to standard?
LARGE_screen_format: Looking at the IMAX and Superscreen booking pages for LSQ, as well as one of the “studio”-sized auditorium, Cineworld’s booking system seems have two different layouts for the screen, one with “SCREEN” in a grey rectangle extending the full width, used for the “studio”-sized auditorium, and the other used for the IMAX/Superscreen, which show a similar rectangle, only the left/right sides are angled. This latter rectangle seems to have a maximum width of ~20 seats or so, and hence is the wrong relative width for the Superscreen as well as the IMAX. Clearly it’s a “generic” layout also in the sense that the seating distance from the screen isn’t represented to any kind of relative scale, either.
Licensing plans are definitely a fantastic resource, but I don’t think I’d thought to search for them either until I read a post on Cinema Treasures by Zappomatic. With inconsistent addresses, slow page load times, and so on— generally very clunky systems used—it’s not always easy to find what you’re looking for, though!
LARGE_screen_format: Licensing plans show everything (within reason) “to scale”—try the “MEZZANINE LEVEL” PDF linked to from the “DOCUMENTS” tab on the linked page.
Based on this, 8 side seats (16 total) of row M (2nd to last row) are beyond the screen edges.
LARGE_screen_format: No idea what the terms of agreement are regarding disclosure but I wouldn’t imagine marketing would be thinking of creating a “buzz” until close to the reopening date.
(I suppose the cost-benefit would be positive, since the marginal cost is essentially zero, if they were thinking of getting out information to more technically-minded enthusiasts. However, I doubt that the success of the project would be riding on this; the average cinema-goer isn’t going to read some article about it hidden away in the “back pages” of the generic “press” and respond to it by thinking “OMG, OLS reopening with Dolby Cinema in many months' time, must talk about it incessantly and remind all my Facebook ‘friends’ every week!”)
I have uploaded a photo, taken last weekend, of the rear “Service Yard” area from Charing Cross Road. A Portakabin that I don’t recall being there previously can be seen positioned by the entrance. The cinema building itself is at the end of the yard, with external staircases, and going by the licensing plans, behind what appear to be broken windows (!) at the upper level are disused dressing rooms.
The upper level auditoria of “Odeon Studios” are just behind these rooms.
I took a number of photos of the Leicester Square frontage, but the changes are not really significant from my last trip. There is a waste chute down from circle foyer level which presumably heads down towards a skip behind the LSQ hoarding, and the hoarding has been extended to cover the entire width of the LSQ frontage.
LARGE_screen_format: If you’re in that area again, you might want to try the Superscreen at the O2, as it has a very well spec’d sound system, with almost the same screen speaker setup as the Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square Superscreen, and Atmos installed since the linked press release was published.
Parking is insanely expensive at the O2, but Cineworld patrons are allowed 4 hours' free parking.
I don’t think I ever went to the smaller auditoria when it was “the filmworks,” although even though I visited on multiple occasions, The only movie I can even recall seeing there was “Ocean’s 11”!
£70 for tickets including concessions? Absurd… looking at the ticket prices for the Greenwich IMAX, it is almost at West End levels?!
Would be interested to see pictures or find out more about these “luxury” “The Gallery” seats. My favourite cinema seats of all time are still the red American Seating Company “rocker”-type seating that were installed in the old Empire 1. (Albeit comparing them to old catalogue photos of their product line, as well as photos of the “new” Empire taken back in 1962, it does seem that they may have “gained” padding when overhauled—either that and/or there were seat covers on top of seat covers!)
BTW, if you are not aware already, Odeon are offering a 40% off discount code valid until the 11th July (works for tickets for 2D/3D performances including premiere seats and PLF screens but not certain titles including “Jurassic World: Fallen Kingdom.”)
Of particular note here is the document titled “KING’S ROAD HISTORIC BUILDING REPORT JUNE 2015” in the 2015 application, which provides a (somewhat “potted”) history of the site. The original 1930s cinema plans—very beautifully drawn—are included on PDF pp28-34. Alas, the text on these is not quite resolved in this file, being throughly obliterated by aggressive JPEG compression.
Plans for the proposed cinema can be seen in the 2016 application at (basement) levels B2 (Auditoria 2 and 3 – “indicative layout” only) and B1 (Auditorium 1), the larger Auditorum 1 being situated above the two smaller auditoria, as is clearly shown in “PROPOSED SECTION AA.”
The architectural practice responsible for these plans is Paul Davis + Partners.
A scale is conveniently provided, and based on this, I estimate Auditorium 1 to be ~27m deep by ~21m wide, or almost 90ft.x70ft., equating to slightly under 6000sq.ft. in area.
The proposed main auditorium is therefore quite generously proportioned, being about the same size as the “existing” auditorium, if its sidewalls were moved in to form a rectangular auditorium. (The “existing” fanned out to about 105ft. wide at the rear.)
HowardBHaas: Estimating from the demolition plans (2016 application, but they’re probably identical in the 2015 application) — the screen width was probably 40-45ft.
More pure nuggets of tedium may be extracted and summarised here if/when I review more of the planning documents!
LARGE_screen_format: Indeed, a list of SRX-515DS equipped locations would be nice!
One of the SRX-515DS equipped locations is Vue Darlington (Link is to a case study from Sound Associates.)
I haven’t seen HFR theatrically, but at home I’ve been watching frame interpolated video for ages (Philips “Pixel Plus” on a 2004 CRT TV, these days “Intelligent Frame Creation”/“24p Smooth Film” on a Panasonic Viera.)
I know some people dislike the artifacts (which can look “plasticky”) with this processing but I’m willing to accept the tradeoff for generally smooth motion.
(Of course, there’s 60fps content out there, including on YouTube.)
All of this should provide a “canvas” which can be creatively used as desired, but personally… I don’t think movies need to look like they were shot on film at 24fps just because that’s what happened to be available for decades.
I think HFR hasn’t gained traction due to the very high overheads, for instance, (at 48fps) twice as many frames must be generated for CGI FX.
As interesting as this all is, I’m struggling to see how this fits in thematically with Cinema Treasures—perhaps we might consider another pathway for communication?
The Sony SRX-R515DS dual projector system in Vue West End Screens 5/7 already supports HFR (48/60fps 2D/3D at 2K resolution per DCP spec.)
Sony also state that the R500-series projectors are all “HDR-ready.”
(Albeit “HDR” in cinemas is something of a minefield!)
Considering that Sony claim 4.5fL 3D brightness is achieveable for the the SRX-R515DS dual projector system on a 23m wide silver screen with 2.4 gain, and the screens installed in Screens 5/7 of Vue West End are Clarus XC 170s (1.7 gain), being slightly larger than 13m wide according to the licensing plans, even allowing for “optimistic” published specifications, they should be able to achieve satisfactory brightness levels for 3D.
Sony also claims 8000:1 contrast ratio for the R515 projectors.
I can’t see Vue being in a tearing hurry to upgrade… it’s already a very good installation that they can advertise as featuring “Finity Sony Digital Cinema 4K” and “Dolby Atmos.”
Also, there are a number of other Vue auditoria in whch the SRX-515DS dual projector system has been installed:
The stadia which all but the front row of the LSQ IMAX seats are attached date from 1962, being the former “circle” seating area of Empire 1.
As theatreofvarieties kindly indicated on Cinema Treasures, in response to my tedious queries, the HVAC (air conditioning) extraction ducting is actually connected to lots of grilles behind the seating, although presumably the extract ducts could always be moved elsewhere or reconnected.
Looking at one of Zappomatic’s photos taken during the recent foyer refurbishment, which provides a partial view under the stadia, it’s clear that there is plenty of steel there, albeit I have no idea what materials are used to form the stepping itself.
Given the above, the fact that Cineworld (presumably) kept the existing intact in the foyer refurbishment works might suggest that there they have no intention of changing the stepping.
If it could be changed from above, it might difficult from a health and safety point of view, and could risk damage to the services and ceiling below.
I suppose they could, depending on structural (weight) limitations, build off the existing, but then this would presumably require the loss of half the rows?
So, based on the above uninformed brain dump and a lot of speculation on my part, it would appear to be a non-starter.
I haven’t been to the Greenwich Odeon since it was “the filmworks”—not difficult for me to get to but AFAIK, as you mention, the IMAX auditorium has a relatively small sized screen; with the BFI and now the Leicester Square IMAX also easy for me to get to, it doesn’t seem worth the bother.
IMO it wasn’t worth visiting when it was “the filmworks,” very much a run of the mill multiplex; albeit, for better or worse, it was one of the earliest examples of an all-“black box” auditoria location in this country.
The last time I purchased food at a cinema was flavoured popcorn at the Odeon Leicester Square in the late 90s. Stopping by Five Guys before or after the performance is a better option in my view. ;–)
Hmm… it might. In my view the LSQ IMAX is currently the best cinema in the West End—not necessarily in terms of programming but as a cinema, i.e. overall package of comfort (legroom issue isn’t a massive problem for me,) outstanding picture quality, middle row seat positioning in relation to the screen, and very good sound also, plus some of the spacious scale and other memories of the old Empire 1 are still there.
However, the concept I have in mind as far as the “première” auditoria are concerned is to be able to see the same film in multiple “premium” formats rather than, say, having to choose between Superscreen/Atmos and IMAX with Laser. Paying the “normal” price for tickets, particularly if the 4DX is included also, starts to become absurd.
The annual cost of the Unlimited West End card still pays for lots of IMAX tickets per year, so, on that basis alone it’s perhaps slightly hard to justify. But then I could see, say, “Rampage” in the IMAX screen… just for the sake of it.
Also, I quite like the idea of cinema trips being special events rather than multiple visits to see whatever in whatever auditorium, which could dilute the experience?
What can I say… I’m just dreadfully slow when it comes to mulling over purchases in excess of three figures… and my number one priority this week by a country mile was getting my air conditioner reinstated at home. :–)
Can’t speak for Cineworld but pretty obviously if you’re rebranding/resigning all the foyer/lobby/access areas then that provides an opportunity to tidy things up by renumbering.
With all incremental changes made over the years including additional auditoria the cinema has become something of a maze, and introducing a 4DX screen only adds to the potential confusion.
The current scheme makes sense in that, from the top of the vestibule stairs up from the Leicester Square entrance, turn left for Screens 1-3, all sequential along the left side of the foyer, and turn right for 5-7, all at upper levels.
That then leaves 4 as the odd one out among 4/8/9 among screens that are normally referenced by “brand name,” but at least the 4DX can’t be confused with another Screen 4.
Other permutations can be thought of that might work, but I think that Cineworld have chosen the best option.
Leaflets promoting the “Unlimited” card were being handed out outside Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square today; I asked the person handing them out what the uplift charge was for the IMAX, and they told me that it is £7. (Perhaps I should “get with it” and use “social media?!”)
12 months of Meerkat Movies can be obtained by purchasing a single days travel insurance within the UK for less than a few pounds! ;o)
That’s a great tip, thank you very much. :–)
I’m going to guess that the uplift charges at LSQ are the same as the premium ticket price minus the standard ticket price—so other than the Superscreen, about £4 more than the Sheffield uplift charges.
P.S. I was a “big fan” of Empire 1 more than am I of the LSQ Superscreen but it’s still a good cinema. ;–)
AFAIK Meerkat Movies (2 for 1) is available for Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square and Vue West End, albeit uplift charges are applied for non-standard seats/screenings.
Alas, I’ve not purchased any products through “Compare the Market.” I did use Orange/EE Wednesdays (2 for 1) a couple of times, although these days friends have to be dragged screaming and kicking to go to the cinema—they’d sooner wait out the Pay TV release window and watch movies on their 60"+ 4K TVs via Sky. In some cases I think they’ve not been to the cinema in such a long time that they have no idea about the comfort levels (e.g. reclining seats) and audio/picture quality available today.
(Having said that, the interest in cinema trips among peers started its decline when the “joys” of grossly excessive alcohol consumption were “discovered!”)
To my mind a film like “Blade Runner 2049” is utterly wasted on TV.
I don’t mind paying West End prices for premiere screens offering exceptional presentation quality (as well as the general high quality and ambience of lobby spaces) but as I said elsewhere on this site it does get absurdly expensive to attend performances in all of the proliferating formats available. I have Cineworld Unlimited West End in mind but there are still uplift charges to pay (and I can’t seem to find what they are for Leicester Square!)
LARGE_screen_format: Interesting, thanks for the info.
Of very little use to me at those locations but if it’s rolled out… I guess this is Vue’s answer to Cineworld’s “Unlimited” card and Odeon’s “Limitless.”
I’ve seen 26.3m for the IMAX screen width, but I can’t find a definitive source for this; however, Vue’s website confirms that it is “one of the largest IMAX screens in Europe.”
BTW, all standard 2D seats are currently £4.99 (!) at this cinema.
LARGE_screen_format: The loss of side seats progressively towards the front of the auditorium occurs elsewhere, notably at the Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square since the circle/stadium section of the converted 1960s auditorium is very wide (estimated (from licensing plans) almost 120ft. at the rear, and about 105ft. at the front row of the stadia, the seating width being reduced there to about 75ft. for IMAX 3D.)
From the licensing plans:
IMAX – 723 seats (and 4 accessible spaces) of which 486 are “3D seats” and 128 are “2D seats” (614 seats for 2D IMAX performances), with the remaining 109 seats being “Non IMAX seats.”
Looking at Odeon’s online booking pages, the BFI IMAX loses 32 seats for 3D presentations.
Regarding Dolby Atmos vs. IMAX 12 channel, Dolby Atmos is unquestionably technically more sophisticated as an objects-based system which can adapt to different speaker layouts. It also provides a separate LFE channel and a derived rear sub-bass (where needed to meet output capability specs for the rears/overheads,) whereas IMAX has one derived sub-bass channel feeding the screen subwoofers.
However, IMAX auditoria ought to be more consistent in terms of geometry and layout, thus reducing the need for an “adaptive” objects-based system. Furthermore, to date all 12 channel installations have been in larger IMAX venues as the original IMAX with Laser system was intended to replace 15/70 projection in IMAX “Grand Theatre” locations.
Thus the speakers should be identical and relatively similarly placed in all auditoria, and the content is remixed by IMAX for their 12 channel format.
Dolby Atmos allows for a range of venues and equipment, albeit Dolby Atmos has quite specific specifications, including speaker layouts, and every installation requires their approval.
An Atmos installation such as the one at the Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square will certainly beat 12 channel IMAX but this a top-end installation (e.g. 5 JBL ScreenArray screen speakers with bafflettes and full active digital crossovers) and so its superiority is not only due to the sound format.
IIRC at the time of opening Cineworld (then Virgin) Sheffield had the widest screen in the country; my vague recollection is that it was about 70ft. wide.
There is also apparently a good Atmos installation in the iSense auditorium.
I vaguely recollect a Cinema Technology Magazine feature on this cinema, but on their revamped site most of the back issues are no longer available online and I can’t find it there. Odeon did/do consider it to be a “flagship” site.
BTW, looking at the cinema’s webpage again, the “Auditorium info” section does state that the IMAX screen size is “10.32 metres high by 18.5 meters [sic] wide.”
According to information on Wikipedia, the Odeon Milton Keynes Stadium IMAX screen is 18.5m by 10.32m (~61x34ft.)—but the citation given is to the cinema’s page on Odeon’s website, and I can’t find the screen size there.
MovieGeek2013: IMAX’s laser projection system also uses DLP chips; the difference is that the light source is laser rather than xenon.
LARGE_screen_format: I travelled there yesterday on the Tube (Jubilee Line.)
The current pricing for parking is on O2 Centre’s website. Given the terms stated on that page, the centre’s 500 car parking spaces are clearly intended more for the use by customers of the supermarket/DIY centre, e.g. the 2 hours' free parking offer for those shopping at those stores is forfeited should the duration of their parking stay exceed 2 hours.
I, too, wasn’t overly impressed by the Xtreme screen (Screen 7) I’ve visited a couple of times at Vue Westfield London (Shepherd’s Bush), nor the venue as a whole for that matter, given that it’s a “flagship” location.
The screen is somewhat bigger than that in the O2 Finchley Road Xtreme (18x10m (~59x33ft.) according to a Time Out article cited by a Wikipedia article) but with 18 rows the auditorium is quite deep.
To cut Vue a bit of slack, although in the case of their two Westfield sites I’m not really sure they deserve any given how successful those locations are, the PLF market and cinemas in general are moving at a very rapid pace.
Personally, I’d rather see a film at Screens 5 or 7 at Vue West End. ;–)
LARGE_screen_format: Responding to the relevant parts of your post on the “Odeon North Greenwich” page dated 2nd July 2018…
The only auditorium photo I can find of this cinema in its original state is one uploaded to Cinema Treasures. Very difficult to tell!
However, there is a photo available of another mid-80s CIC auditorium, namely the old Empire 3, which provides a better view of its seating; these seats do seem to bare some resemblance in form to the American Seating Company seats that were in the old Empire 1, although they have a headrest section.
Perhaps, then, those installed at High Wycombe were a similar model to those in the old Empire 1.
Photo of an auditorium at Empire High Wycombe dated 2015.
Are these the ones that were installed for “the filmworks” overhaul? I assume the stadia was built then also?
I guess at that point the path of least resistance was to “skip” the old and replace.
If that’s how that auditorium looks today then it really needs a makeover—the seats are sagging and the carpet looks like it’s seen better days! (Maybe wet cleaning would be sufficient.)
Alas, the American Seating Company sold its “Architectural Fixed Seating” business to the Irwin Seating Company. Of the American Seating Company’s auditorium seating product lines, the “Stellar” series is in their catalogue, but one might imagine that there might be implications in terms of spare parts availablity for older seats. Now if only I could find “Empire 1”-type (“1960 Comfort Deluxe mode” according to a post on Cinema Treasures by theatreofvarieties) seats on eBay…
The replacement seating for the IMAX conversion was a “custom” design supplied by Seating Concepts:
How We Helped the Historic Chinese Theatre in Los Angeles with Its Recent Overhaul—Seating Concepts.
LARGE_screen_format: AFAIK the TCL Chinese Theatre IMAX auditorium doesn’t conform to the basic IMAX geometry requirements in that the auditorium depth exceeds the screen width.
(“Back of an envelope” calculation: 23 rows deep x assume 4ft. per row = 92ft. [i.e. almost ~94ft. screen width!] front-to-back distance required for the seating alone—no space for the central gangway nor between the screen and front row!)
A quick look at a photo of the IMAX Melbourne auditorium reveals that the rows are widely spaced.
“Back of an envelope” calculation: If the auditorium depth = screen width and the first row is 0.35x screen width from the screen, per classic IMAX requirements, this leaves about 68ft. depth for the seating. There are 12 rows, so this works out at slightly less than 5.7ft row spacing. Taking these assumptions further, were the row spacing reduced to 4ft., then this would enable around 200 extra seats.
Zappomatic: Thanks for the photos, looks good!
(Hmm, except for the slightly tacky red backlit Cineworld “stars” on the sidewalls.)
360° photos of the foyer (one taken from upper vestibule, the other from the far end), Screen 1 and Screen 2 can be seen on Squaremeal’s website, under the “Virtual Tour” section towards the bottom of the page (“Room List” at the top right of the photo view area is used to select the desired shot.)
In the photo of Screen 1, the yellow upholstered door with “porthole” is still in place!
“Cineworld London Venues” — photos of the LSQ IMAX, O2 Superscreen, Cineworld Wembley and Wandsworth.)
There are photos of the 4DX auditorium in the “carousel” at the top of the page, and if it is available to book, it’s perhaps amusing to imagine a corporate event being ruined by rogue use of the 4DX environmental effects. ;–)
Photos of the former Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square Screens 4/5 are available in Eomac’s literature in the PDF linked to from the linked page.
The new stadia do seem to have quite an improved rake. I can’t see more than 3 sidewall speakers in the “new” Screen 2, whereas the former Screen 4 had 4—although the front one may be washed out.
Zappomatic: How does the new Lino Sonego seating compare to the previous? (AFAIK from Seating Concepts.) Is the picture/sound quality up to standard?
LARGE_screen_format: Looking at the IMAX and Superscreen booking pages for LSQ, as well as one of the “studio”-sized auditorium, Cineworld’s booking system seems have two different layouts for the screen, one with “SCREEN” in a grey rectangle extending the full width, used for the “studio”-sized auditorium, and the other used for the IMAX/Superscreen, which show a similar rectangle, only the left/right sides are angled. This latter rectangle seems to have a maximum width of ~20 seats or so, and hence is the wrong relative width for the Superscreen as well as the IMAX. Clearly it’s a “generic” layout also in the sense that the seating distance from the screen isn’t represented to any kind of relative scale, either.
Licensing plans are definitely a fantastic resource, but I don’t think I’d thought to search for them either until I read a post on Cinema Treasures by Zappomatic. With inconsistent addresses, slow page load times, and so on— generally very clunky systems used—it’s not always easy to find what you’re looking for, though!
LARGE_screen_format: Licensing plans show everything (within reason) “to scale”—try the “MEZZANINE LEVEL” PDF linked to from the “DOCUMENTS” tab on the linked page.
Based on this, 8 side seats (16 total) of row M (2nd to last row) are beyond the screen edges.
LARGE_screen_format: No idea what the terms of agreement are regarding disclosure but I wouldn’t imagine marketing would be thinking of creating a “buzz” until close to the reopening date.
(I suppose the cost-benefit would be positive, since the marginal cost is essentially zero, if they were thinking of getting out information to more technically-minded enthusiasts. However, I doubt that the success of the project would be riding on this; the average cinema-goer isn’t going to read some article about it hidden away in the “back pages” of the generic “press” and respond to it by thinking “OMG, OLS reopening with Dolby Cinema in many months' time, must talk about it incessantly and remind all my Facebook ‘friends’ every week!”)
I have uploaded a photo, taken last weekend, of the rear “Service Yard” area from Charing Cross Road. A Portakabin that I don’t recall being there previously can be seen positioned by the entrance. The cinema building itself is at the end of the yard, with external staircases, and going by the licensing plans, behind what appear to be broken windows (!) at the upper level are disused dressing rooms.
The upper level auditoria of “Odeon Studios” are just behind these rooms.
I took a number of photos of the Leicester Square frontage, but the changes are not really significant from my last trip. There is a waste chute down from circle foyer level which presumably heads down towards a skip behind the LSQ hoarding, and the hoarding has been extended to cover the entire width of the LSQ frontage.
LARGE_screen_format: If you’re in that area again, you might want to try the Superscreen at the O2, as it has a very well spec’d sound system, with almost the same screen speaker setup as the Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square Superscreen, and Atmos installed since the linked press release was published.
Parking is insanely expensive at the O2, but Cineworld patrons are allowed 4 hours' free parking.
I don’t think I ever went to the smaller auditoria when it was “the filmworks,” although even though I visited on multiple occasions, The only movie I can even recall seeing there was “Ocean’s 11”!
£70 for tickets including concessions? Absurd… looking at the ticket prices for the Greenwich IMAX, it is almost at West End levels?!
Would be interested to see pictures or find out more about these “luxury” “The Gallery” seats. My favourite cinema seats of all time are still the red American Seating Company “rocker”-type seating that were installed in the old Empire 1. (Albeit comparing them to old catalogue photos of their product line, as well as photos of the “new” Empire taken back in 1962, it does seem that they may have “gained” padding when overhauled—either that and/or there were seat covers on top of seat covers!)
BTW, if you are not aware already, Odeon are offering a 40% off discount code valid until the 11th July (works for tickets for 2D/3D performances including premiere seats and PLF screens but not certain titles including “Jurassic World: Fallen Kingdom.”)
The main planning applications relating to the redevelopment are:
PP/15/04338 – “Partial demolition and redevelopment of 196-222 King’s Road with a two storey basement excavation, to provide cinema floor space at basement and ground floor level; (etc…)”.
PP/16/04793 – “New plans reflecting proposed changes including the demolition and rebuild of Friese Green House, alterations to the King’s Road elevation, additional basement excavation and provision of additional photovoltaic panels”.
Of particular note here is the document titled “KING’S ROAD HISTORIC BUILDING REPORT JUNE 2015” in the 2015 application, which provides a (somewhat “potted”) history of the site. The original 1930s cinema plans—very beautifully drawn—are included on PDF pp28-34. Alas, the text on these is not quite resolved in this file, being throughly obliterated by aggressive JPEG compression.
Plans for the proposed cinema can be seen in the 2016 application at (basement) levels B2 (Auditoria 2 and 3 – “indicative layout” only) and B1 (Auditorium 1), the larger Auditorum 1 being situated above the two smaller auditoria, as is clearly shown in “PROPOSED SECTION AA.”
The architectural practice responsible for these plans is Paul Davis + Partners.
A scale is conveniently provided, and based on this, I estimate Auditorium 1 to be ~27m deep by ~21m wide, or almost 90ft.x70ft., equating to slightly under 6000sq.ft. in area.
The proposed main auditorium is therefore quite generously proportioned, being about the same size as the “existing” auditorium, if its sidewalls were moved in to form a rectangular auditorium. (The “existing” fanned out to about 105ft. wide at the rear.)
HowardBHaas: Estimating from the demolition plans (2016 application, but they’re probably identical in the 2015 application) — the screen width was probably 40-45ft.
More pure nuggets of tedium may be extracted and summarised here if/when I review more of the planning documents!
LARGE_screen_format: Indeed, a list of SRX-515DS equipped locations would be nice!
One of the SRX-515DS equipped locations is Vue Darlington (Link is to a case study from Sound Associates.)
I haven’t seen HFR theatrically, but at home I’ve been watching frame interpolated video for ages (Philips “Pixel Plus” on a 2004 CRT TV, these days “Intelligent Frame Creation”/“24p Smooth Film” on a Panasonic Viera.)
I know some people dislike the artifacts (which can look “plasticky”) with this processing but I’m willing to accept the tradeoff for generally smooth motion.
(Of course, there’s 60fps content out there, including on YouTube.)
All of this should provide a “canvas” which can be creatively used as desired, but personally… I don’t think movies need to look like they were shot on film at 24fps just because that’s what happened to be available for decades.
I think HFR hasn’t gained traction due to the very high overheads, for instance, (at 48fps) twice as many frames must be generated for CGI FX.
As interesting as this all is, I’m struggling to see how this fits in thematically with Cinema Treasures—perhaps we might consider another pathway for communication?
LARGE_screen_format:
The Sony SRX-R515DS dual projector system in Vue West End Screens 5/7 already supports HFR (48/60fps 2D/3D at 2K resolution per DCP spec.)
Sony also state that the R500-series projectors are all “HDR-ready.”
(Albeit “HDR” in cinemas is something of a minefield!)
Considering that Sony claim 4.5fL 3D brightness is achieveable for the the SRX-R515DS dual projector system on a 23m wide silver screen with 2.4 gain, and the screens installed in Screens 5/7 of Vue West End are Clarus XC 170s (1.7 gain), being slightly larger than 13m wide according to the licensing plans, even allowing for “optimistic” published specifications, they should be able to achieve satisfactory brightness levels for 3D.
Sony also claims 8000:1 contrast ratio for the R515 projectors.
I can’t see Vue being in a tearing hurry to upgrade… it’s already a very good installation that they can advertise as featuring “Finity Sony Digital Cinema 4K” and “Dolby Atmos.”
Also, there are a number of other Vue auditoria in whch the SRX-515DS dual projector system has been installed:
Vue International’s largest cinema screens go 4K.
LARGE_screen_format:
The stadia which all but the front row of the LSQ IMAX seats are attached date from 1962, being the former “circle” seating area of Empire 1.
As theatreofvarieties kindly indicated on Cinema Treasures, in response to my tedious queries, the HVAC (air conditioning) extraction ducting is actually connected to lots of grilles behind the seating, although presumably the extract ducts could always be moved elsewhere or reconnected.
Looking at one of Zappomatic’s photos taken during the recent foyer refurbishment, which provides a partial view under the stadia, it’s clear that there is plenty of steel there, albeit I have no idea what materials are used to form the stepping itself.
Given the above, the fact that Cineworld (presumably) kept the existing intact in the foyer refurbishment works might suggest that there they have no intention of changing the stepping.
If it could be changed from above, it might difficult from a health and safety point of view, and could risk damage to the services and ceiling below.
I suppose they could, depending on structural (weight) limitations, build off the existing, but then this would presumably require the loss of half the rows?
So, based on the above uninformed brain dump and a lot of speculation on my part, it would appear to be a non-starter.
BTW: Photo of the IMPACT/Superscreen auditorium build – stadium seating structure can be seen. Note that the steel girder supporting the balcony is actually hung from the roof structure!
Did you enjoy “Rampage”?
I haven’t been to the Greenwich Odeon since it was “the filmworks”—not difficult for me to get to but AFAIK, as you mention, the IMAX auditorium has a relatively small sized screen; with the BFI and now the Leicester Square IMAX also easy for me to get to, it doesn’t seem worth the bother.
IMO it wasn’t worth visiting when it was “the filmworks,” very much a run of the mill multiplex; albeit, for better or worse, it was one of the earliest examples of an all-“black box” auditoria location in this country.
The last time I purchased food at a cinema was flavoured popcorn at the Odeon Leicester Square in the late 90s. Stopping by Five Guys before or after the performance is a better option in my view. ;–)
Hmm… it might. In my view the LSQ IMAX is currently the best cinema in the West End—not necessarily in terms of programming but as a cinema, i.e. overall package of comfort (legroom issue isn’t a massive problem for me,) outstanding picture quality, middle row seat positioning in relation to the screen, and very good sound also, plus some of the spacious scale and other memories of the old Empire 1 are still there.
However, the concept I have in mind as far as the “première” auditoria are concerned is to be able to see the same film in multiple “premium” formats rather than, say, having to choose between Superscreen/Atmos and IMAX with Laser. Paying the “normal” price for tickets, particularly if the 4DX is included also, starts to become absurd.
The annual cost of the Unlimited West End card still pays for lots of IMAX tickets per year, so, on that basis alone it’s perhaps slightly hard to justify. But then I could see, say, “Rampage” in the IMAX screen… just for the sake of it.
Also, I quite like the idea of cinema trips being special events rather than multiple visits to see whatever in whatever auditorium, which could dilute the experience?
What can I say… I’m just dreadfully slow when it comes to mulling over purchases in excess of three figures… and my number one priority this week by a country mile was getting my air conditioner reinstated at home. :–)
Can’t speak for Cineworld but pretty obviously if you’re rebranding/resigning all the foyer/lobby/access areas then that provides an opportunity to tidy things up by renumbering.
With all incremental changes made over the years including additional auditoria the cinema has become something of a maze, and introducing a 4DX screen only adds to the potential confusion.
The current scheme makes sense in that, from the top of the vestibule stairs up from the Leicester Square entrance, turn left for Screens 1-3, all sequential along the left side of the foyer, and turn right for 5-7, all at upper levels.
That then leaves 4 as the odd one out among 4/8/9 among screens that are normally referenced by “brand name,” but at least the 4DX can’t be confused with another Screen 4.
Other permutations can be thought of that might work, but I think that Cineworld have chosen the best option.
Leaflets promoting the “Unlimited” card were being handed out outside Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square today; I asked the person handing them out what the uplift charge was for the IMAX, and they told me that it is £7. (Perhaps I should “get with it” and use “social media?!”)
LARGE_screen_format: Don’t worry, it’s the thought that counts. :–) Unlimited trips to the LSQ Superscreen would be just great. :–)
LARGE_screen_format:
That’s a great tip, thank you very much. :–)
I’m going to guess that the uplift charges at LSQ are the same as the premium ticket price minus the standard ticket price—so other than the Superscreen, about £4 more than the Sheffield uplift charges.
P.S. I was a “big fan” of Empire 1 more than am I of the LSQ Superscreen but it’s still a good cinema. ;–)
AFAIK Meerkat Movies (2 for 1) is available for Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square and Vue West End, albeit uplift charges are applied for non-standard seats/screenings.
Alas, I’ve not purchased any products through “Compare the Market.” I did use Orange/EE Wednesdays (2 for 1) a couple of times, although these days friends have to be dragged screaming and kicking to go to the cinema—they’d sooner wait out the Pay TV release window and watch movies on their 60"+ 4K TVs via Sky. In some cases I think they’ve not been to the cinema in such a long time that they have no idea about the comfort levels (e.g. reclining seats) and audio/picture quality available today.
(Having said that, the interest in cinema trips among peers started its decline when the “joys” of grossly excessive alcohol consumption were “discovered!”)
To my mind a film like “Blade Runner 2049” is utterly wasted on TV.
I don’t mind paying West End prices for premiere screens offering exceptional presentation quality (as well as the general high quality and ambience of lobby spaces) but as I said elsewhere on this site it does get absurdly expensive to attend performances in all of the proliferating formats available. I have Cineworld Unlimited West End in mind but there are still uplift charges to pay (and I can’t seem to find what they are for Leicester Square!)
LARGE_screen_format: Interesting, thanks for the info.
Of very little use to me at those locations but if it’s rolled out… I guess this is Vue’s answer to Cineworld’s “Unlimited” card and Odeon’s “Limitless.”
I’ve seen 26.3m for the IMAX screen width, but I can’t find a definitive source for this; however, Vue’s website confirms that it is “one of the largest IMAX screens in Europe.”
BTW, all standard 2D seats are currently £4.99 (!) at this cinema.
I believe it was that auditorium (Screen 7) that was converted to IMAX.
Sheffield Telegraph article.
I also vaguely recollect that Screen 7 was THX certified on opening, but I’m not confident about this.
LARGE_screen_format: The loss of side seats progressively towards the front of the auditorium occurs elsewhere, notably at the Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square since the circle/stadium section of the converted 1960s auditorium is very wide (estimated (from licensing plans) almost 120ft. at the rear, and about 105ft. at the front row of the stadia, the seating width being reduced there to about 75ft. for IMAX 3D.)
From the licensing plans:
IMAX – 723 seats (and 4 accessible spaces) of which 486 are “3D seats” and 128 are “2D seats” (614 seats for 2D IMAX performances), with the remaining 109 seats being “Non IMAX seats.”
Looking at Odeon’s online booking pages, the BFI IMAX loses 32 seats for 3D presentations.
Regarding Dolby Atmos vs. IMAX 12 channel, Dolby Atmos is unquestionably technically more sophisticated as an objects-based system which can adapt to different speaker layouts. It also provides a separate LFE channel and a derived rear sub-bass (where needed to meet output capability specs for the rears/overheads,) whereas IMAX has one derived sub-bass channel feeding the screen subwoofers.
However, IMAX auditoria ought to be more consistent in terms of geometry and layout, thus reducing the need for an “adaptive” objects-based system. Furthermore, to date all 12 channel installations have been in larger IMAX venues as the original IMAX with Laser system was intended to replace 15/70 projection in IMAX “Grand Theatre” locations.
Thus the speakers should be identical and relatively similarly placed in all auditoria, and the content is remixed by IMAX for their 12 channel format.
Dolby Atmos allows for a range of venues and equipment, albeit Dolby Atmos has quite specific specifications, including speaker layouts, and every installation requires their approval.
An Atmos installation such as the one at the Cineworld (Empire) Leicester Square will certainly beat 12 channel IMAX but this a top-end installation (e.g. 5 JBL ScreenArray screen speakers with bafflettes and full active digital crossovers) and so its superiority is not only due to the sound format.
IIRC at the time of opening Cineworld (then Virgin) Sheffield had the widest screen in the country; my vague recollection is that it was about 70ft. wide.
There is also apparently a good Atmos installation in the iSense auditorium.
I vaguely recollect a Cinema Technology Magazine feature on this cinema, but on their revamped site most of the back issues are no longer available online and I can’t find it there. Odeon did/do consider it to be a “flagship” site.
BTW, looking at the cinema’s webpage again, the “Auditorium info” section does state that the IMAX screen size is “10.32 metres high by 18.5 meters [sic] wide.”
It definitely isn’t worth visiting! Undiscounted ticket prices are high also.
That said, cinema customers are actually eligible for the “shopper tariff,” so it would be £6 for 3-4 hours.
According to information on Wikipedia, the Odeon Milton Keynes Stadium IMAX screen is 18.5m by 10.32m (~61x34ft.)—but the citation given is to the cinema’s page on Odeon’s website, and I can’t find the screen size there.
MovieGeek2013: IMAX’s laser projection system also uses DLP chips; the difference is that the light source is laser rather than xenon.
LARGE_screen_format: I travelled there yesterday on the Tube (Jubilee Line.)
The current pricing for parking is on O2 Centre’s website. Given the terms stated on that page, the centre’s 500 car parking spaces are clearly intended more for the use by customers of the supermarket/DIY centre, e.g. the 2 hours' free parking offer for those shopping at those stores is forfeited should the duration of their parking stay exceed 2 hours.
I, too, wasn’t overly impressed by the Xtreme screen (Screen 7) I’ve visited a couple of times at Vue Westfield London (Shepherd’s Bush), nor the venue as a whole for that matter, given that it’s a “flagship” location.
The screen is somewhat bigger than that in the O2 Finchley Road Xtreme (18x10m (~59x33ft.) according to a Time Out article cited by a Wikipedia article) but with 18 rows the auditorium is quite deep.
To cut Vue a bit of slack, although in the case of their two Westfield sites I’m not really sure they deserve any given how successful those locations are, the PLF market and cinemas in general are moving at a very rapid pace.
Personally, I’d rather see a film at Screens 5 or 7 at Vue West End. ;–)