Hello all, Sorry I have not answered some requests. My laptop died and had to be sent back to HP. I just saw the photos. Wll it looks like the Commodore is dead. Even for 3 milion, I do not believe it is worth thr process. Custer, how were you able to gt in to it Aren’t there guards around.
From talking to the owners, it was secrecy about even telling people about it let alone letting someone it. Did you sneak in? I know more workmen do not care if you stay out of their way
Anyway it looks like the new owners the hasidim took care of things, and made changes to it, so there is no possible opportunity to landmark the building.
Custer when you were in there, did it see like there were squatters and homeles people there too?
I am posting this here, because this is more relevant to questions about the Franklin Square Theater, but was part of the discussion about GG Theaters about the Herricks Theater.
In an old Newsaday clipping, it lists that Franklin Cinema was part of the GG cinema group, which anyone who went there would find hard to believe simply by the way the theater was run. It was no Loews, from their “Quading” to playing movies without audiences. Here is a link to the newsday advertisement that list both the Herricks and Franklin as part of the GG theater group. I spent a lot of time at the Franklin as a kid, and again, I find it very hard to believe that this theater before Clearview was a “corparately run” theater. I always thought it was an independently owned and operated theater.
(I AM POSTING THE NEWSDAY LINK TO THE GG ADVERT AT BOTTOM OF POST)
What were the GG Cinemas anyway? One owner, owner affiliation to get bookings of the first run releases, co-op etc? Though I went to both the Herricks and Franklin growing up, both GG theaters, I never felt they were coporate or even franchised, just independent theaters just by the way they were run, the management “Decisions” made. I am using the Franklin as an example, because I spent the most time there and find the most bizarre decisions, from construction to running films without audiences there!
Was GG renamed Clearview when it was bought by Cablevision? When I was growing up, it seemed like the Franklin which my friends and I used to go to at least on day a weekend, seem to be more of an independent theater. Could I be wrong about that? Was GG just a sort of “Co-op” of theaters to book movies so they can get first runs against the big chains or was it an actual corporation? The Franklin I know was never an RKO, a Century, Loews, Sony, etc. but I never remember it ever being a GG theater or even advertising any kind of chain affiliation except in the paper.
It seemed so too, it was independently operated the way it was run, and also the way it quaded. They just took the two small balconies and made theaters of them.
It was very strange how it was quaded, because first off, it looked to the naked eye about only 50 seats if that much, and then there was an area, the same size where no seats were, and then the screen. I do not know if it was structually unsound to put seats, but they did not have bars so you could not walk on them, and you could walk up and touch the screen as you sometimes did as “crazy teenagers.” It if was a corporate of theaters, I doubt they would have quaded the theater in this way, because the cost of rental against the number of seats, it really would seem, “what is the point?” if you only have 50-75 seats in the theater?
I even remember on a couple of occasions seeing a day, non matinee for another film, and walking into both the big theater and the small theater on seperate occasions and the movie was running but no one was in the theater. When I asked about that, they said, no one had come for the 3:30 showing on a summer weekday. I asked, “Why then, after a half hour, do you not just shut the film off? I was told, they keep in on just in case people come late! Well we know movies never start on time because of previews etc, and then after a half hour and no tickets sold? That does not sound like a corporate run theater.
For that reason it seems like it was some kind of independent theater that either joined the GG group for advertising and movie booking purposes or was bought and joined with Clearview when Cablevision bought it. Does someone have the history of GG, and how it evolved to Clearview and the purchase by Cablevision?
Needless to say, movies up there on the “living room theaters”, were always sold out on the weekends.
What were the GG Cinemas anyway? One owner, owner affiliation to get bookings of the first run releases, co-op etc? Though I went to both the Herricks and Franklin growing up, both GG theaters, I never felt they were coporate or even franchised, just independent theaters just by the way they were run, the management “Decisions” made. I am using the Franklin as an example, because I spent the most time there and find the most bizarre decisions, from construction to running films without audiences there!
Was GG renamed Clearview when it was bought by Cablevision? When I was growing up, it seemed like the Franklin which my friends and I used to go to at least on day a weekend, seem to be more of an independent theater. Could I be wrong about that? Was GG just a sort of “Co-op” of theaters to book movies so they can get first runs against the big chains or was it an actual corporation? The Franklin I know was never an RKO, a Century, Loews, Sony, etc. but I never remember it ever being a GG theater or even advertising any kind of chain affiliation except in the paper.
It seemed so too, it was independently operated the way it was run, and also the way it quaded. They just took the two small balconies and made theaters of them.
It was very strange how it was quaded, because first off, it looked to the naked eye about only 50 seats if that much, and then there was an area, the same size where no seats were, and then the screen. I do not know if it was structually unsound to put seats, but they did not have bars so you could not walk on them, and you could walk up and touch the screen as you sometimes did as “crazy teenagers.” It if was a corporate of theaters, I doubt they would have quaded the theater in this way, because the cost of rental against the number of seats, it really would seem, “what is the point?” if you only have 50-75 seats in the theater?
I even remember on a couple of occasions seeing a day, non matinee for another film, and walking into both the big theater and the small theater on seperate occasions and the movie was running but no one was in the theater. When I asked about that, they said, no one had come for the 3:30 showing on a summer weekday. I asked, “Why then, after a half hour, do you not just shut the film off? I was told, they keep in on just in case people come late! Well we know movies never start on time because of previews etc, and then after a half hour and no tickets sold? That does not sound like a corporate run theater.
For that reason it seems like it was some kind of independent theater that either joined the GG group for advertising and movie booking purposes or was bought and joined with Clearview when Cablevision bought it. Does someone have the history of GG, and how it evolved to Clearview and the purchase by Cablevision?
Needless to say, movies up there on the “living room theaters”, were always sold out on the weekends.
Here is something you all should know. I know the theater will never live up to what it used to be. But if you still live on Long Island and have Cablevision “triple play” digital cable, internet, and voice, got to www.optimumrewards.com and apply for a rewards card. With the card, Clearview Cinemas such as the Franklin, Herricks, Manhasset, Great Neck, Port Washington etc, check under www.clearviewcinemas.com, then you are entitled to this rewards card, that gives you free movie tickets for a family of 4 on Tuesdays(EVERY TUESDAY!) and $6 adult tickets, even on Saturday evenings throughout the week. It also gives you presales, to big concerts at MSG and Radio City.
This is not an advertisement for Cablevision. I HATE THEM! The control too much and speaking of old movie houses, for old movies they have kept Turner Classics and other networks that compete with networks like the defunct American Movie Classics, now American Movie Channel, in an unfair monopoly! At least get the reward cards and make sure you go to the movies on Tuesdays whenever you can can and use the discount card whenever you go to a Clearview movie theater. If you are going anyway, at least take money out of their EVIL CORPORATE POCKETS!
Here is something you all should know. I know the theater will never live up to what it used to be. But if you still live on Long Island and have Cablevision “triple play” digital cable, internet, and voice, got to www.optimumrewards.com and apply for a rewards card. With the card, Clearview Cinemas such as the Franklin, Herricks, Manhasset, Great Neck, Port Washington etc, check under www.clearviewcinemas.com, then you are entitled to this rewards card, that gives you free movie tickets for a family of 4 on Tuesdays(EVERY TUESDAY!) and $6 adult tickets, even on Saturday evenings throughout the week. It also gives you presales, to big concerts at MSG and Radio City.
This is not an advertisement for Cablevision. I HATE THEM! The control too much and speaking of old movie houses, for old movies they have kept Turner Classics and other networks that compete with networks like the defunct American Movie Classics, now American Movie Channel, in an unfair monopoly! At least get the reward cards and make sure you go to the movies on Tuesdays whenever you can can and use the discount card whenever you go to a Clearview movie theater. If you are going anyway, at least take money out of their EVIL CORPORATE POCKETS!
Hops,
If you give me your email in your Cinema Treasure profile, I will get in touch with you. I did not put my email online, not because of the people here, but the people who search sites like this for addressed to spam, and we can chat.
I can understand the cost of $.75 and turning the projector on where it ended.
BTW, My mother is from Williamsburg and I moved back to the area in the mid 1990’s, might to my grandmother’s chagrin. “We spent our whole lives getting out of that neighborhood, and now you move back.” I kept telling her it was different now, with one person in a one bedroom apartment, not a whole family, but she did not understand! But that is whole different story!
Anyway, growing up on Long Island, I remember the RKO Century chain offering in its low attendance theaters, second run, new releases, maybe out for 3 or 4 months (today it would be out on DVD already!) being offered as a double feature or one feature depending on how long your stayed. I remember the Belrose theater was like this on the Queens/Nassau border. The price, would go up with the year. .78 cents in 1978, .79 cents in 1979. I guess the inflations of the 1970’s caught up because once 1980 rolled around it was $1 at all times.
The theater was in bad shape, a once grand neighborhood movie house had paint chipping etc. The screen needed to be repaired from holes even the concession stand, you could tell, the stale popcorn and close to expiring movie candy was shipped there for your enjoyment!
You knew, they were either waiting for a buyer, a fire, or anything else to unload it.
So the concept of the .75 cent cost at the Graham is not that foreign!
You can got to NYC.gov and look of the film commission. They usually tell you where permits are issued and whole is filming so you can avoid the area and traffic.
I actually found the broker and have access to the city records to this. So if you can email me directly through Cinema Treasures, I will email you back with my direct email address.
Anyone remember what went in there after? Consumer’s Distributors, which was just like service merchandise? Remember those days when they had that big catalog and did not stock things, and you had to order from it, and wait a few weeks! Yes a few weeks for something to come. I remember, being so long, after my parents ordered stuff like Star Wars merchandise, the few weeks felt like eternity!
EFAjr, Still have the cash to buy back to Commodore?
Two years ago, the Hasidim wanted $3 million for it. I do not think they will go any lower unfortunately, if anything they might go higher over the last two years.
However, did you all know that Williamsburg had Vaudville theaters on every block during the 1920’s and 1930’s? The Commodore was the last working theater of these however, I might suspect, behind one of these warehouses or several of them is an old theater. I already, through research found old breweries more towards bushwick, but when asked to see the warehouse from calling the “For Rent” sign, I found the underground cooling area before refrigeration was electric.
So maybe with a little reserach you can find a theater behind the aluminum siding. Now might be the best time. With the rezoning of Williamsburg, you could save it and get it for cheap if you can find the hidden theaters that be could be historic landmarks that the developers cannot rip down.
The Commodore to me would be great to save, but the location is horrible. It is kind of out of the way from the rest of “trendy” Williamsburg, meaning, on one side, you have the end of the gentified area, and on the other the Hasidim, who I can surely tell you would not see a movie.
The second is the location to the subway. It was there long before the subway came through. The theater only closed a few years ago though. In fact the first “Lord of the Rings” did play there. Yes, the Peter Jackson one, not the cartoon!
Anyone know how the sound was with the subway going by? Was it sound proofed or did you have to live with it? I remember even the basement screening rooms at Tisch School of the Arts had that problem with the N and R train, as much as it was sound proofed, you could not get rid of the subway noise and vibration. Sitting in class, we could feel and hear the subway, though you got used to it.
I am wondering with an elevated subway going right by a theater, how much noise is made and if the theater would vibrate as like I said, the theater was there long before the subway and the theater was not made to be a neighbor!
A theater did open on Metropolitan between Union and Lorimer. I remember when it first opened as “Jack of all trades” space where the guy who rented it, rented it out for yoga, art openings, etc. It is a converted garage and raw space.
OK EFAjr, email me through this site, and I will send you my contact email and phone number. I cannot promise you they will sell to you, but I can find the out information if I look though my notes, or search the lexis site,
I was looking for what was playing at the Nick because I am visiting Boston for the first time in five years and it was one of my favorite places in Boston. I went to BU College of Communications for one year 1990-1991 and I was miserable and I hated Boston. Before everyone jumps all over me, after growing up in NY and parent’s who trusted, to me Boston was a very provincial city at 18m and with the Gestapo housing rules instituted by John Silber at the height of his power, I had more freedom in my parents' house. I can put this is these terms. In 1988, Playboy voted BU one of the 10 best pary schools in the US, by 1990, having more than 5 people in your room led to party violation, housing demerits and a letter home to mom and dad. 3 of these violations, and your thown of of housing. This was only a small piece of the two year turnaround. You could get thrown out of poison for a hot pot. I arrived in the second year of this gestapo. For me this was not college living. At the time were were paying $22,000 a year tuition a bargain now, but BU was in the top ten in costs too, and I had curfews or could not check into a friends dorm after midnight? So with the NICK after a 9:30, the girl I was with, we would either have to run back to one of our dorms, or just kiss each other good night. This was not college, or a normal apartment, this was a minimum security prison.
I transfereed to NYU the following fall because BU and COM introduced me to filmmaking because of their “general curriculum” in COM the first year where you did a little of everything that was COM. I started out as a broadcast journalism major, but after switching to film, I thought, why live in Boston? My parents will pay for me to go live away from home, so I would be living in Manhattan, not outside, NYU has the best undergraduate program and for the record, I got into Tisch as a freshman but declined because I wanted to try something else. Thank god the accepted me a second time. It was a big changed living in the NYU dorms. You no longer live in fear!
I love NYC, a native and have lived in Euorope, Los Angles and other places but I am always homesick for New York. Not where my parent’s live or I grew up, but NYC. I will always think of Boston as a beautiful city, and though 2 out of every 5 people in the city are students, I was not happy there. The city closed early, you could not drink alcohol, etc, all the things that going to college is all about. NOw more settled, and exhausted by 11pm, I would move to Boston, if offered, but my business is based in NY and Los Angeles.
As for the Nick, it was escape for when I was miserable. It was more like the Angelica in NY. I saw many films Hamlet with Mel Gibson (I know), Metropolitan and the first NC-17 film, Henry and June, which my friends and I made sure we were there opening as did half of BU. The place was packed and sold out. I did not understand the rating. It was a beautiful movie, and it is a shame it was tarnished by the NC-17 rating. We were all waiting for something offensive but nothing happened.
I am surprised and not surprised that BU took down the buiding. Although a little not surprised. The three largest land owners in Boston, are the City, the State and BU. Same in New York, NYU owns Greenwich Village, even buildings that still operation what appears seperately from the university. But again the largest landowners in NYC, are the City, the State and NYU.
The Nick in Boston, I am sad is gone. It was not really a cinema treasure. It was a mondern brick structure and renovated inside and at all. There question online here about classes. Well I guess because BU owned the property, they made a deal with Loews that during the day and times without movies showing, BU held classes at the Nick. I know some of you said the Nick was 35mm and most films 16 mm, there was one class I do remember having a class at the Nick where a movie was shown. It was more of a recent films, and it could be the 35mm projector was used. But as an almost general rule, we could have a class in a movie theater but have to few the film in another room. I am not sure it was because of the equipment, it has to do with money. Just because you pay $35,000 to go there, does not mean you should have access to a projessor, just a TA, as well a showing films. Remember that projectionists a re unionized. With 16mm, it is easy for an overworked TA to set up a projectoer. But setting up 35 mm, which is not that easy to go on the big screen, You need a bonehead union guy, who at the most took a how to seminar to get certified.
Again, I am very sad at the Nick. It was the perfect location for BU students and it seemed the theater and the school too care of each other. With the Loews banruptcy, nothing should have changed, except instead of Loews paying for the rent, BU which already opened the theater should have stayed a nighttime theater and a daytime classroom. They should have Loew manage the theater but hire students. Students as usual pay BU probably $6,00 for internship credit and then these students rotate for a semester and learn about distribtution and running a theater learning from Loews. We have heard of teaching hospital, this should been a teaching theater.
The one good thing that BU did with its vast assets was buying the club Narcissus. The area around Kenmore Sq, and Landownes street was the club area. Kenmore Square was the worst between 1:30 and 3"30, when the clubs let out. Their were everything from industry and grudge clubs to gay clubs etc. They would leave and go to Kenmore SQ for a piece of pizza to catch the last T or catch a cab. BUt people did not say, “oh well the club is over, lets just go home” So everyone would hang out in Kenmore, every different minority, gay and lesbian and every kind of music lover drunks and put in the same place. Not good. Fights everywhere.
Any way as for Narcisis it was the trashiest, guido and guidette, big hair hangout. BU bought the building and got rid of the club thank God. I believe they did it for security. It was the only clib no on Landsdowne street but in Kenmore Square. I guess they figured keeping all the clubs someowhere. even a block aways, the patrons would be more apt to take another direction to a diner in the Fenway or get their car out of the lot near Fenways park.
But funniest things was we used to call Narcisis as Narsiphilus. Who knows what you could pick up from the people there.
Well I sure my grammar is bad. I am writing this at 4 AM, and can barely keep my eyes open. But I miss the Nick. I think BU made a huge mistake!
The theater was sold for $1.6 million. However in my email above, I spoke to people who own the theater as per the city sales list and probably connected to ECP. They did not know what they were doing at the time. They bought theater but had no plans, at least what they said even though it says differently in the announcement. The owner told me that he would be interested in selling the theater for $3 million, however, the deal breaker was the fact that, they would not let anyone allowed in to take pictures or to see the interior or inspections reports until you put $3 million is escorow to prove you had $3 milllion. When I explained there is a possibility to get investors to put up the money but I must have information and picture to show in order to raise the funding, they told me that is NOT HOW BUSINESS IS DONE. Seeing a prospective property before putting $3 million is escorow, is like telling someone if they want to buy a house, you have to purchase it before you can see the inside,what state the house and property is in or any documentation by building inspectors and other paperwork that is normally offered by a seller interested in selling. Sure you have heard stories of people who buy properties sight unseen, but that is unusual rather than the norm. Clearly they would be interesting in selling if someone walked in with $3 million. I got the feeling even if did show up with a $3 million cashiers check, they would demand it be paid in cash. Mind you also, they claimed they had yet to make any changes to the property but already almost doubled the price. I know the real estate market has even quadrupled in some areas of the last 5 years. But any attempt to buy, when they claimed they would want to sell, seemed like it would be a deal with the devil.
As an MBA can assure you, THAT IS NOT HOW ONE DOES BUSINESS even if the new owners said so or otherwise. I also doubt, this real estate company would have bought the Commodore understand same circumstances.
But the bottom line once again, unless the architect’s name is known, not just the firm, the Commodore cannot be saved by historical landmark status as the last of many vaudville houses in Williamsburg and we all must remember, owners can do whatever they want with their OWN property.
It was poorly kept with a lot of “Cinemuck” the mixture of popcorn, candy and any other things stuck to the floor. I remember because one of the first originally series on HBO, had a segment called, “Signlets.” Words that ought to be in the dictionary, but not!
I do not know. The last I heard was it was going to become a Yeshiva. The owners seem to be these sleazy hasidim. I talked to them about buying it, and said I was going to get investors together and they told me they would sell for 3million, even though they bought for just 1.5 million a few months before, and would not let me see the interior unless I had check made out to them for $3 million as “good faith” However, there good faith issue was not mutual becuse I could not raise money without seeing the interior and get structual and other reports etc. So they said then the were not interested. If someone else once to try to make deal with them. Be my guest, but I am an MBA, so I am pretty good at knowing what is needed and what is usually required in a deal like this. The good faither “Check” is favor unusual and to tell you the truth in bad faith and bad taste especailly since they wanted me to get them in a weeks time.
I am sure they could too. The problem is the owners of the Commodore do not want to turn it into a live theater. So that is not going to happen unless someone buys it who does. They own it, and the current owners cannot be forced, to keep it as a theater.
With Rezoning of Northside it is Rumored a Multiplex will be built on the Northside!
Well everyone I am sure you have heard that the rezoning has been approved and luxury lofts and two 40 story buildings on each side of the new state park that will have an NYU stadium has been approved. The plan is for 40,000 new apartments on the Northside and Greenpoint. 40,000! So at least 40,000 new people will be moving to the Northside and I heard rumors of an Old Navy and Barnes and Noble. I am happy that finally all those empty building for rent that the landlords would not rent will be converted and these 40,000 new tenants will all have loft like condos. That is what people want these days, loft like condos. With development like this you can expect the building of a multiplex. It is sad in a way that Williamsburg will now be like parkslope, or modeled after Battery Park City, Jersey City or Hoboken. The area East of the BQE will untouched because it is already zoned for residential, the area around the Lorimer and Graham stops. I am sure now, with this kind construction we will once again have a movie theater, maybe even a multiplex. The Commodore is gone for good it seems, and soon we might have a theater that will not have rumbling trains going by from the EL. I believe the kind of multiplex will be like the Kaufman Astoria multiplex in Astoria.
Do some this is bad news, to others good. I have mix feeling about this. I believe building parkland on the waterfront and now allowing conversion of all the industrial buildings to residential will beautify the neighborhood. It would be nice to have an esplanade that the governor and the mayor want to stretch from Greenpoint to Bayride. However, Williamsburg does not need a 40 story building, and two is too much. It seems those buildings are to be modeled after that giant building in Long Island City that we can see in the skyline near the other tall building in Long Island City, the Citibank building.
Rezoning areas like Williamsburg have been a mandate for Bloomberg. By rezoning, his people believe it will beautify neighborhoods, from Billburg to Redhook. Even Brooklyn Heights which already has the beautiful promenade will once again have access to the waterfront as the abandoned docks below the promenade will be turned into parkland.
I know some are you against the Yuppifying of Williamsburg, and now with Barnes and Noble, Old Navy and possibly a multiplex will more than likely bring what we all think as the ultimate evil, Starbucks. The Williamsburg Warrior group tried to stop this and even protested. But the fight is over. On May 11th the city council voted for rezoning that land owners from the those in small houses to big warehouse owners have fought for. Even the Communnity Board to a point contributed to this rezoning when the threat of a power plant coming to the waterfront, they sent recommendations and their own studies of rezoning to the City as the plan 197a. There is even animation and models online for all to look at which I will post below.
I am very sad about the Commodore because I did try to save it as you can see from my past posts and even talked to the Katherine Oliver the film commissioner about making it a landmark. But as we thought and dreamed about the Commodore, maybe we should have looked more at the big picture.
The one thing I all want you to consider though is what past industry before more strict dumping laws came into affect. Within the last six months, when rezoning was being debated I cut out an article with a map of the burg and Greenpoint. This map got me very upset. My mother was born at the former Wiliamsburg Maternity Hospital on Humboldt and Baptize at the Ukranian Catholic Church on North 6th Street. To me coming back to burg, was a “return” because this area was the place my Grandparents moved to after living briefly in Pennsylvannia to pursue the American dream. This inspired me to live here, and remain here, hope to buy a house eventually, and raise a family here. I attended NYU in the early 1990’s and lived in the East Village when it was still a war zone, and was part of the crowd to gentrify it. After college I moved to Los Angeles for 5 years to get my masters from UCLA. I returned and was very upset that the area no one wanted to live in , that I took a chance on, was no longer affordable, and young artist and young people started out were pushed into the sea. I was happy though to be part of the people gentrifying Williamsburg and vowed never to leave the neighborhood, I “helped to rebuild” However this map in the Post was shocking. And upfront I would like to say it was not a right wing attempt to push through rezoning because of the Post’s politics. My area, the one where I had roots from 60 years ago and now wanted to live and raise an family, is badly contaminated, especially the most expensive section the Northside. Because the area was working class, and then minorities without political clout, company’s began dumping toxic and harmful chemicals, in their basements and illegally dumping in empty lots in the neighborhood. These companies have left, but there damage remains.
The empty lot on North 12th and Bedford, has been empty for as long as I have lived in the burg, 6 years. I asked many people why, and few could say, because they were also new residence. I finally investigated on my own, searching through the library and asking older residence. That empty lot was a paint factory, and full of toxic waste. That is why not only is it an empty lot but also locked and chained up. The plan for that empty lot which we all most know is valuable land, right on the main drag of Bedford Ave and next to the park was suppose to become a shopping center that would included a small multiplex or at least a new movie theater. A theater similar to the Angelika I was told, but the rumor about the movie theater is hearsay. But what I did find out is the reason it has remained idle is a legal battle over who should clean up the hazardous waste, the former owners or the new owners. Cleaning up this waste is expensive with the workers needing to wear protective clothing and gloves similar to those used by workers who clean asbestos another lie we were told just like the hazardous waste. What gets me is, if this stuff is dangerous, and the land of the northside contaminated, why will workers touching that soil be protected, but yet, anyone walking around Bedford Ave is not even notified of the hazards. I am sure on a hot and humid summer day, pedestrians wearing very little clothing such as t-shirts, shorts and sandals, walk by the site all the time, probably being exposed to it, as the hot humid day might even cause the hazardous waste seep upwards. Or even think about this, wearing you summer attire and playing ball across the street and rolling around in the soil and grass of McCarren Park or the dogs digging and sniffing in the Dog Run on North 12 and Driggs near by, rolling around, digging, and possibly ingesting soil.
This is not the only area as this Post indicated. All over the Northside is toxic waste dumped into the ground. The N 12th empty lot is right next to McCarren Park. How much toxic waste has seeped in there where we play ball, our dogs play in the dog run nearby and our children or soon to be children will play. This map was such an eye opener that if something did not change or get cleaned up, Williamsburg which I love, and have roots in dating back 60 years, is not a place I want to raise children, have my dog play, or even play ball. Luckily, I live near the Lorimer stop, which was always residential, and very few industry, so at least at the present time, where I live is not affected. But it is not a big enough place to raise a family and even if it were, I am sure my kids would have friends on the the Northside. How could I endanger them by allowing them to play over there without knowing where they are playing or how badly the toxic waste and pollution have spread because the dumping begain 40 years ago. Even thinking about it now, I am sure my kids would think I am horrible dad for not letting them play with their friends in the neighborhood.
Although I am not happy with 40 story building and some of the plan of redevelopment, I am very happy the city council passed the plan and the immediate rezoning and redevelopment will begin ASAP. Why? Because as part of the plan, the toxic and hazardous waste will be required to be cleaned and the city would assist with money to do so. Which ever place you stand or rezoning and redevelopment, no one liberal, conservative, activist, silent majority, whatever label you might consider yourself should have themselves or their families whether living now or future plans be exposed to the mess of big business. Who knows, I had a friend who had a small vegetable garden in her backyard on the Northside and would often give me things from her garden. I did tell her about the possible hazards of the soil, but she did not take me seriously. But to not to be inpolite on a few occasions, I accepted some veggies from her garden, which I immediately threw out. Not only have we all be exposed, but, the though of eating from gardens in the burg is unsettling. For those of you wanting families in the future and staying in the burg, could the current problem become a problem for the health of our future offspring, not living in the area I am talking development in the womb. I do not buy the argument that was in a local paper when a baby store opened on Bedford Ave that one young resident stated, “If you want to have kids, you should move to Park Slope.” If you agree or disagree about this statement, either way, you should be allowed to have a family anywhere, without fear of some ignorant 20 year old, but have exposure to toxins.
So to conclude this view on getting a movie theater in the Burg. It looks like with a redevelopment like this, no company like UA, Loews, Clearview or AMC, would allow redevelopment in an area with young, educated and cultured people pass them by. As far as chains like Old Navy or Barne and Noble, I honestly believe that a movie theater company if one but all, would bid to build a multiplex and could lead to the Burg/Greenpoint once again having just as many screens as it did in the glory days when single screen theaters were the standard. It is unfortunate, the Commodore cannot be saved or every other theater in the 11211 area that closed over the past 20 years. But one thing is for sure, no matter how many screens we have, at least we can live in the burg knowing, our health is not in danger.
Here is the animation section of the City Planning Commission rendition of what the Northside will look like from different “drives” through the rezoning area. For those of you like me who love the burg now, this can be shocking to see so prepare yourself because the debate has passed and the City has approved the rezoning. So there is very little to be done. The one thing that most on the City Council agreed upon was that if the waterfront was not rezoned, more than likely, a power plant or a “Garbage Station” would once again be considered for the burg and probably pass. To the City Council and local leaders this was their only chance to clean up the waste, and save the burg and Greenpoint from any talk of a power plant or a “garbage station” Without rezoning these two environmental evils would be put back on table and this time, no matter how protested, it would not be defeated again.
So below are the plans for the Burg, with the Animaton link first. I know some of you might find this upsetting, but please, I am onl y the messenger.
The entire plan and proposal approved by the City: View link
And finally the website of the “Williamsburg Warriors” who should be commended for putting up a good fight and organizing protests and petitions. Though I believe there link for sigining a petition is outdated. They have very good links to websites such as Marty M’s proposed changes to the plans, such as rejection of the 40 story Building.
I hope you all agree with me that the Commodore is a tragedy. But at least a mulitplex might be better than nothing. And again, I am just informing you all that such a theater is rumored to be in works. So please, don’t shoot the messenger!
Thanks for all you responses, but honestly, I have seen theaters like this that were quaded and yes they mixed mordern walls the beauty, but that is more done to keep the original beauty intct. RCDTJ, said he thanks god it closed before they could butched it. I disagree. I would rather have a quad theater with artifacts of the past, that if the day should come to open as a vaudvile theater or such, the walls can be taken down. Working in film, tv and stage, I even seen theaters that movie theaters with a wall down the middle and when a stage show was done, the wall actually folded up.
Yes parking was a problem with all of these, but I’d rather of my old Floral in some form, with its beauty on one wall that I sit in rather than no Floral at all. Ditto for the Calderone.
If you disagree, I just want to remind you of the Landmark Sunshine Theater on Houston Street. When I lived downtown around there at NYU, when the East Village was becoming trendy but the lower eastside still was scary after dark, I remember in the day going to Schimmels and remember the warehouse next store. Who knew when the things are wiped away and restored, that old warehouse was the old yiddish playhouse! Just because they would use modern walls the quad it, the Sunshine goes to show you, sometimes not destroying and waiting for a “theaters” time again to rise, restoring the Floral is better than the present day office building and catering hall.
I miss the Floral and would have taken a quaded one anyday over closing forever and more or less butchering the theater when it moves to another use.
Hands down, in Nassau, the Floral was one of the most beautful theaters in the county. How is was not landmarked it was a mystey to me. Supposedly, it was one of Long Island premiere movies houses, and when I say premiere, I mean, cast members, while promoting the movie in New York would come to the Floral because of the beauty and the way the theater was set up. When it closed I remember an article in Newsday, that I think are the Long Island opening of Mildred Pierce, Joan Crawford, came out on the stage when either before it started or ended. The unfortunate thing now, is that people in this area are stuck either going to the Clearview Theaters like the Herricks and Franklin Square which are pretty good, but nothing like the Floral. The Floral showed all the great movies, I remember, my 11th birthday, my parents took 10 friends of mine and me to see Return of The Jedi, which is the last movie I remember seeing there in 1983. And then it close for quading that never happened. This theater was so beautiful, that even quading it would have been a shame. It did look like it are one time was Nassau Counties, Radio City Music Hall. I do remember the balcony always being closed, except of course for movies like Jedi, when they needed the space. But they even had boxes if I remember correctly on the side like Radio City and other fancy theaters. They were never opened, but that is the kind of theater we are talking about.
The area around the Floral as I said has only three options the Herricks and the Franklin Six which both were single theaters divided so much, that on a busy first weekend Friday and Satuday night you are better going to the raceway because you will never get a ticket. But quading the Floral, really would have been the only way for it to survive, because this theater was huge, and even Jedi, once the balcony opened, was still not sold out. Imagine today, the new Star Wars plays on the six screens, the Floral could hold that capacity in its one theater.
In my opinion what killed the Floral and not quading, was parking, parking, parking. The Floral was built at a time when the movie theater was like the communnity entertainment center in the days before tv, but by the mid 1980’s, Everyone drove there. Well you can imagine a theater with 1654 seats, even quaded, where do you park the car? It still was a busy merchant street, and there was one municipal lot that with a generous estimate, 50 cars! How can you have a theater that big and so few parking spaces. I remember, the streets around it had one hour parking, so side street parking was out of the question. I hope the owners attempted to have a garge built somewhere turn the small parking lot into multi level lot. I am sure, someone with a theater like that would have done anything to keep it open if they were going to quad it. But parking is what killed the beauty, just like when live in Los Angeles, they would knocked down old homes that were almost historic, and buidlings from the old hollywood of the 30’s and 40’s to make parking. That area just had no room for parking except that small lot. And the community was not helping but now allowing sreet parking. So that is how a beauty like the Floral died and Franklin Sq and Herricks are the only game in town beside the mall area. Parking. The Herricks has its own parking lot. And across Hempstead Tpk, the Franklin Sq theaters as two huge public town lots used on Sunday mornings for the hundreds of parishoners of St Catherines around the corner and during the week and rest of the weekend, the movie theater as free parking for any one, in the village park lot with no meters. So even when the FS theater is sold out as it frequently is with small theaters, the lots are never filled to capacity.
Again, though I spent much of teens at the Herrick and the Franklin to see movies, it is just heartbreaking to see a theater like the Floral be destroyed by PARKING! To me, that is a sin, and the community should have done something save the building including landmarking it. But now it is gone, and will never return. Another case where “they took an idol and smashed it!”
Hello all, Sorry I have not answered some requests. My laptop died and had to be sent back to HP. I just saw the photos. Wll it looks like the Commodore is dead. Even for 3 milion, I do not believe it is worth thr process. Custer, how were you able to gt in to it Aren’t there guards around.
From talking to the owners, it was secrecy about even telling people about it let alone letting someone it. Did you sneak in? I know more workmen do not care if you stay out of their way
Anyway it looks like the new owners the hasidim took care of things, and made changes to it, so there is no possible opportunity to landmark the building.
Custer when you were in there, did it see like there were squatters and homeles people there too?
I am posting this here, because this is more relevant to questions about the Franklin Square Theater, but was part of the discussion about GG Theaters about the Herricks Theater.
In an old Newsaday clipping, it lists that Franklin Cinema was part of the GG cinema group, which anyone who went there would find hard to believe simply by the way the theater was run. It was no Loews, from their “Quading” to playing movies without audiences. Here is a link to the newsday advertisement that list both the Herricks and Franklin as part of the GG theater group. I spent a lot of time at the Franklin as a kid, and again, I find it very hard to believe that this theater before Clearview was a “corparately run” theater. I always thought it was an independently owned and operated theater.
(I AM POSTING THE NEWSDAY LINK TO THE GG ADVERT AT BOTTOM OF POST)
What were the GG Cinemas anyway? One owner, owner affiliation to get bookings of the first run releases, co-op etc? Though I went to both the Herricks and Franklin growing up, both GG theaters, I never felt they were coporate or even franchised, just independent theaters just by the way they were run, the management “Decisions” made. I am using the Franklin as an example, because I spent the most time there and find the most bizarre decisions, from construction to running films without audiences there!
Was GG renamed Clearview when it was bought by Cablevision? When I was growing up, it seemed like the Franklin which my friends and I used to go to at least on day a weekend, seem to be more of an independent theater. Could I be wrong about that? Was GG just a sort of “Co-op” of theaters to book movies so they can get first runs against the big chains or was it an actual corporation? The Franklin I know was never an RKO, a Century, Loews, Sony, etc. but I never remember it ever being a GG theater or even advertising any kind of chain affiliation except in the paper.
It seemed so too, it was independently operated the way it was run, and also the way it quaded. They just took the two small balconies and made theaters of them.
It was very strange how it was quaded, because first off, it looked to the naked eye about only 50 seats if that much, and then there was an area, the same size where no seats were, and then the screen. I do not know if it was structually unsound to put seats, but they did not have bars so you could not walk on them, and you could walk up and touch the screen as you sometimes did as “crazy teenagers.” It if was a corporate of theaters, I doubt they would have quaded the theater in this way, because the cost of rental against the number of seats, it really would seem, “what is the point?” if you only have 50-75 seats in the theater?
I even remember on a couple of occasions seeing a day, non matinee for another film, and walking into both the big theater and the small theater on seperate occasions and the movie was running but no one was in the theater. When I asked about that, they said, no one had come for the 3:30 showing on a summer weekday. I asked, “Why then, after a half hour, do you not just shut the film off? I was told, they keep in on just in case people come late! Well we know movies never start on time because of previews etc, and then after a half hour and no tickets sold? That does not sound like a corporate run theater.
For that reason it seems like it was some kind of independent theater that either joined the GG group for advertising and movie booking purposes or was bought and joined with Clearview when Cablevision bought it. Does someone have the history of GG, and how it evolved to Clearview and the purchase by Cablevision?
Needless to say, movies up there on the “living room theaters”, were always sold out on the weekends.
View link
What were the GG Cinemas anyway? One owner, owner affiliation to get bookings of the first run releases, co-op etc? Though I went to both the Herricks and Franklin growing up, both GG theaters, I never felt they were coporate or even franchised, just independent theaters just by the way they were run, the management “Decisions” made. I am using the Franklin as an example, because I spent the most time there and find the most bizarre decisions, from construction to running films without audiences there!
Was GG renamed Clearview when it was bought by Cablevision? When I was growing up, it seemed like the Franklin which my friends and I used to go to at least on day a weekend, seem to be more of an independent theater. Could I be wrong about that? Was GG just a sort of “Co-op” of theaters to book movies so they can get first runs against the big chains or was it an actual corporation? The Franklin I know was never an RKO, a Century, Loews, Sony, etc. but I never remember it ever being a GG theater or even advertising any kind of chain affiliation except in the paper.
It seemed so too, it was independently operated the way it was run, and also the way it quaded. They just took the two small balconies and made theaters of them.
It was very strange how it was quaded, because first off, it looked to the naked eye about only 50 seats if that much, and then there was an area, the same size where no seats were, and then the screen. I do not know if it was structually unsound to put seats, but they did not have bars so you could not walk on them, and you could walk up and touch the screen as you sometimes did as “crazy teenagers.” It if was a corporate of theaters, I doubt they would have quaded the theater in this way, because the cost of rental against the number of seats, it really would seem, “what is the point?” if you only have 50-75 seats in the theater?
I even remember on a couple of occasions seeing a day, non matinee for another film, and walking into both the big theater and the small theater on seperate occasions and the movie was running but no one was in the theater. When I asked about that, they said, no one had come for the 3:30 showing on a summer weekday. I asked, “Why then, after a half hour, do you not just shut the film off? I was told, they keep in on just in case people come late! Well we know movies never start on time because of previews etc, and then after a half hour and no tickets sold? That does not sound like a corporate run theater.
For that reason it seems like it was some kind of independent theater that either joined the GG group for advertising and movie booking purposes or was bought and joined with Clearview when Cablevision bought it. Does someone have the history of GG, and how it evolved to Clearview and the purchase by Cablevision?
Needless to say, movies up there on the “living room theaters”, were always sold out on the weekends.
Here is something you all should know. I know the theater will never live up to what it used to be. But if you still live on Long Island and have Cablevision “triple play” digital cable, internet, and voice, got to www.optimumrewards.com and apply for a rewards card. With the card, Clearview Cinemas such as the Franklin, Herricks, Manhasset, Great Neck, Port Washington etc, check under www.clearviewcinemas.com, then you are entitled to this rewards card, that gives you free movie tickets for a family of 4 on Tuesdays(EVERY TUESDAY!) and $6 adult tickets, even on Saturday evenings throughout the week. It also gives you presales, to big concerts at MSG and Radio City.
This is not an advertisement for Cablevision. I HATE THEM! The control too much and speaking of old movie houses, for old movies they have kept Turner Classics and other networks that compete with networks like the defunct American Movie Classics, now American Movie Channel, in an unfair monopoly! At least get the reward cards and make sure you go to the movies on Tuesdays whenever you can can and use the discount card whenever you go to a Clearview movie theater. If you are going anyway, at least take money out of their EVIL CORPORATE POCKETS!
Here is something you all should know. I know the theater will never live up to what it used to be. But if you still live on Long Island and have Cablevision “triple play” digital cable, internet, and voice, got to www.optimumrewards.com and apply for a rewards card. With the card, Clearview Cinemas such as the Franklin, Herricks, Manhasset, Great Neck, Port Washington etc, check under www.clearviewcinemas.com, then you are entitled to this rewards card, that gives you free movie tickets for a family of 4 on Tuesdays(EVERY TUESDAY!) and $6 adult tickets, even on Saturday evenings throughout the week. It also gives you presales, to big concerts at MSG and Radio City.
This is not an advertisement for Cablevision. I HATE THEM! The control too much and speaking of old movie houses, for old movies they have kept Turner Classics and other networks that compete with networks like the defunct American Movie Classics, now American Movie Channel, in an unfair monopoly! At least get the reward cards and make sure you go to the movies on Tuesdays whenever you can can and use the discount card whenever you go to a Clearview movie theater. If you are going anyway, at least take money out of their EVIL CORPORATE POCKETS!
Hops,
If you give me your email in your Cinema Treasure profile, I will get in touch with you. I did not put my email online, not because of the people here, but the people who search sites like this for addressed to spam, and we can chat.
Ligg
I can understand the cost of $.75 and turning the projector on where it ended.
BTW, My mother is from Williamsburg and I moved back to the area in the mid 1990’s, might to my grandmother’s chagrin. “We spent our whole lives getting out of that neighborhood, and now you move back.” I kept telling her it was different now, with one person in a one bedroom apartment, not a whole family, but she did not understand! But that is whole different story!
Anyway, growing up on Long Island, I remember the RKO Century chain offering in its low attendance theaters, second run, new releases, maybe out for 3 or 4 months (today it would be out on DVD already!) being offered as a double feature or one feature depending on how long your stayed. I remember the Belrose theater was like this on the Queens/Nassau border. The price, would go up with the year. .78 cents in 1978, .79 cents in 1979. I guess the inflations of the 1970’s caught up because once 1980 rolled around it was $1 at all times.
The theater was in bad shape, a once grand neighborhood movie house had paint chipping etc. The screen needed to be repaired from holes even the concession stand, you could tell, the stale popcorn and close to expiring movie candy was shipped there for your enjoyment!
You knew, they were either waiting for a buyer, a fire, or anything else to unload it.
So the concept of the .75 cent cost at the Graham is not that foreign!
I am sorry, I meant look “up” and “who” is filming.
To make up for my mistakes in spelling. Here is the link:
View link
You can got to NYC.gov and look of the film commission. They usually tell you where permits are issued and whole is filming so you can avoid the area and traffic.
I actually found the broker and have access to the city records to this. So if you can email me directly through Cinema Treasures, I will email you back with my direct email address.
It is still baffling after making phone calls what is going to be done with it.
Anyone remember what went in there after? Consumer’s Distributors, which was just like service merchandise? Remember those days when they had that big catalog and did not stock things, and you had to order from it, and wait a few weeks! Yes a few weeks for something to come. I remember, being so long, after my parents ordered stuff like Star Wars merchandise, the few weeks felt like eternity!
Yes, It was first Ponderosa Steak house and then there was a German sausage place like Wiener Schnitzel, but not that chain..
EFAjr, Still have the cash to buy back to Commodore?
Two years ago, the Hasidim wanted $3 million for it. I do not think they will go any lower unfortunately, if anything they might go higher over the last two years.
However, did you all know that Williamsburg had Vaudville theaters on every block during the 1920’s and 1930’s? The Commodore was the last working theater of these however, I might suspect, behind one of these warehouses or several of them is an old theater. I already, through research found old breweries more towards bushwick, but when asked to see the warehouse from calling the “For Rent” sign, I found the underground cooling area before refrigeration was electric.
So maybe with a little reserach you can find a theater behind the aluminum siding. Now might be the best time. With the rezoning of Williamsburg, you could save it and get it for cheap if you can find the hidden theaters that be could be historic landmarks that the developers cannot rip down.
The Commodore to me would be great to save, but the location is horrible. It is kind of out of the way from the rest of “trendy” Williamsburg, meaning, on one side, you have the end of the gentified area, and on the other the Hasidim, who I can surely tell you would not see a movie.
The second is the location to the subway. It was there long before the subway came through. The theater only closed a few years ago though. In fact the first “Lord of the Rings” did play there. Yes, the Peter Jackson one, not the cartoon!
Anyone know how the sound was with the subway going by? Was it sound proofed or did you have to live with it? I remember even the basement screening rooms at Tisch School of the Arts had that problem with the N and R train, as much as it was sound proofed, you could not get rid of the subway noise and vibration. Sitting in class, we could feel and hear the subway, though you got used to it.
I am wondering with an elevated subway going right by a theater, how much noise is made and if the theater would vibrate as like I said, the theater was there long before the subway and the theater was not made to be a neighbor!
Anyone have some experiences to tell?
A theater did open on Metropolitan between Union and Lorimer. I remember when it first opened as “Jack of all trades” space where the guy who rented it, rented it out for yoga, art openings, etc. It is a converted garage and raw space.
However it is a live theater not a movie theater unfortunately. The website is: http://www.bricktheater.com/Home.html
OK EFAjr, email me through this site, and I will send you my contact email and phone number. I cannot promise you they will sell to you, but I can find the out information if I look though my notes, or search the lexis site,
I would be interested in helping. I am on disability for my back, so I have a lot of time on my hands. Please let me know!
I was looking for what was playing at the Nick because I am visiting Boston for the first time in five years and it was one of my favorite places in Boston. I went to BU College of Communications for one year 1990-1991 and I was miserable and I hated Boston. Before everyone jumps all over me, after growing up in NY and parent’s who trusted, to me Boston was a very provincial city at 18m and with the Gestapo housing rules instituted by John Silber at the height of his power, I had more freedom in my parents' house. I can put this is these terms. In 1988, Playboy voted BU one of the 10 best pary schools in the US, by 1990, having more than 5 people in your room led to party violation, housing demerits and a letter home to mom and dad. 3 of these violations, and your thown of of housing. This was only a small piece of the two year turnaround. You could get thrown out of poison for a hot pot. I arrived in the second year of this gestapo. For me this was not college living. At the time were were paying $22,000 a year tuition a bargain now, but BU was in the top ten in costs too, and I had curfews or could not check into a friends dorm after midnight? So with the NICK after a 9:30, the girl I was with, we would either have to run back to one of our dorms, or just kiss each other good night. This was not college, or a normal apartment, this was a minimum security prison.
I transfereed to NYU the following fall because BU and COM introduced me to filmmaking because of their “general curriculum” in COM the first year where you did a little of everything that was COM. I started out as a broadcast journalism major, but after switching to film, I thought, why live in Boston? My parents will pay for me to go live away from home, so I would be living in Manhattan, not outside, NYU has the best undergraduate program and for the record, I got into Tisch as a freshman but declined because I wanted to try something else. Thank god the accepted me a second time. It was a big changed living in the NYU dorms. You no longer live in fear!
I love NYC, a native and have lived in Euorope, Los Angles and other places but I am always homesick for New York. Not where my parent’s live or I grew up, but NYC. I will always think of Boston as a beautiful city, and though 2 out of every 5 people in the city are students, I was not happy there. The city closed early, you could not drink alcohol, etc, all the things that going to college is all about. NOw more settled, and exhausted by 11pm, I would move to Boston, if offered, but my business is based in NY and Los Angeles.
As for the Nick, it was escape for when I was miserable. It was more like the Angelica in NY. I saw many films Hamlet with Mel Gibson (I know), Metropolitan and the first NC-17 film, Henry and June, which my friends and I made sure we were there opening as did half of BU. The place was packed and sold out. I did not understand the rating. It was a beautiful movie, and it is a shame it was tarnished by the NC-17 rating. We were all waiting for something offensive but nothing happened.
I am surprised and not surprised that BU took down the buiding. Although a little not surprised. The three largest land owners in Boston, are the City, the State and BU. Same in New York, NYU owns Greenwich Village, even buildings that still operation what appears seperately from the university. But again the largest landowners in NYC, are the City, the State and NYU.
The Nick in Boston, I am sad is gone. It was not really a cinema treasure. It was a mondern brick structure and renovated inside and at all. There question online here about classes. Well I guess because BU owned the property, they made a deal with Loews that during the day and times without movies showing, BU held classes at the Nick. I know some of you said the Nick was 35mm and most films 16 mm, there was one class I do remember having a class at the Nick where a movie was shown. It was more of a recent films, and it could be the 35mm projector was used. But as an almost general rule, we could have a class in a movie theater but have to few the film in another room. I am not sure it was because of the equipment, it has to do with money. Just because you pay $35,000 to go there, does not mean you should have access to a projessor, just a TA, as well a showing films. Remember that projectionists a re unionized. With 16mm, it is easy for an overworked TA to set up a projectoer. But setting up 35 mm, which is not that easy to go on the big screen, You need a bonehead union guy, who at the most took a how to seminar to get certified.
Again, I am very sad at the Nick. It was the perfect location for BU students and it seemed the theater and the school too care of each other. With the Loews banruptcy, nothing should have changed, except instead of Loews paying for the rent, BU which already opened the theater should have stayed a nighttime theater and a daytime classroom. They should have Loew manage the theater but hire students. Students as usual pay BU probably $6,00 for internship credit and then these students rotate for a semester and learn about distribtution and running a theater learning from Loews. We have heard of teaching hospital, this should been a teaching theater.
The one good thing that BU did with its vast assets was buying the club Narcissus. The area around Kenmore Sq, and Landownes street was the club area. Kenmore Square was the worst between 1:30 and 3"30, when the clubs let out. Their were everything from industry and grudge clubs to gay clubs etc. They would leave and go to Kenmore SQ for a piece of pizza to catch the last T or catch a cab. BUt people did not say, “oh well the club is over, lets just go home” So everyone would hang out in Kenmore, every different minority, gay and lesbian and every kind of music lover drunks and put in the same place. Not good. Fights everywhere.
Any way as for Narcisis it was the trashiest, guido and guidette, big hair hangout. BU bought the building and got rid of the club thank God. I believe they did it for security. It was the only clib no on Landsdowne street but in Kenmore Square. I guess they figured keeping all the clubs someowhere. even a block aways, the patrons would be more apt to take another direction to a diner in the Fenway or get their car out of the lot near Fenways park.
But funniest things was we used to call Narcisis as Narsiphilus. Who knows what you could pick up from the people there.
Well I sure my grammar is bad. I am writing this at 4 AM, and can barely keep my eyes open. But I miss the Nick. I think BU made a huge mistake!
The theater was sold for $1.6 million. However in my email above, I spoke to people who own the theater as per the city sales list and probably connected to ECP. They did not know what they were doing at the time. They bought theater but had no plans, at least what they said even though it says differently in the announcement. The owner told me that he would be interested in selling the theater for $3 million, however, the deal breaker was the fact that, they would not let anyone allowed in to take pictures or to see the interior or inspections reports until you put $3 million is escorow to prove you had $3 milllion. When I explained there is a possibility to get investors to put up the money but I must have information and picture to show in order to raise the funding, they told me that is NOT HOW BUSINESS IS DONE. Seeing a prospective property before putting $3 million is escorow, is like telling someone if they want to buy a house, you have to purchase it before you can see the inside,what state the house and property is in or any documentation by building inspectors and other paperwork that is normally offered by a seller interested in selling. Sure you have heard stories of people who buy properties sight unseen, but that is unusual rather than the norm. Clearly they would be interesting in selling if someone walked in with $3 million. I got the feeling even if did show up with a $3 million cashiers check, they would demand it be paid in cash. Mind you also, they claimed they had yet to make any changes to the property but already almost doubled the price. I know the real estate market has even quadrupled in some areas of the last 5 years. But any attempt to buy, when they claimed they would want to sell, seemed like it would be a deal with the devil.
As an MBA can assure you, THAT IS NOT HOW ONE DOES BUSINESS even if the new owners said so or otherwise. I also doubt, this real estate company would have bought the Commodore understand same circumstances.
But the bottom line once again, unless the architect’s name is known, not just the firm, the Commodore cannot be saved by historical landmark status as the last of many vaudville houses in Williamsburg and we all must remember, owners can do whatever they want with their OWN property.
It was poorly kept with a lot of “Cinemuck” the mixture of popcorn, candy and any other things stuck to the floor. I remember because one of the first originally series on HBO, had a segment called, “Signlets.” Words that ought to be in the dictionary, but not!
I do not know. The last I heard was it was going to become a Yeshiva. The owners seem to be these sleazy hasidim. I talked to them about buying it, and said I was going to get investors together and they told me they would sell for 3million, even though they bought for just 1.5 million a few months before, and would not let me see the interior unless I had check made out to them for $3 million as “good faith” However, there good faith issue was not mutual becuse I could not raise money without seeing the interior and get structual and other reports etc. So they said then the were not interested. If someone else once to try to make deal with them. Be my guest, but I am an MBA, so I am pretty good at knowing what is needed and what is usually required in a deal like this. The good faither “Check” is favor unusual and to tell you the truth in bad faith and bad taste especailly since they wanted me to get them in a weeks time.
I am sure they could too. The problem is the owners of the Commodore do not want to turn it into a live theater. So that is not going to happen unless someone buys it who does. They own it, and the current owners cannot be forced, to keep it as a theater.
With Rezoning of Northside it is Rumored a Multiplex will be built on the Northside!
Well everyone I am sure you have heard that the rezoning has been approved and luxury lofts and two 40 story buildings on each side of the new state park that will have an NYU stadium has been approved. The plan is for 40,000 new apartments on the Northside and Greenpoint. 40,000! So at least 40,000 new people will be moving to the Northside and I heard rumors of an Old Navy and Barnes and Noble. I am happy that finally all those empty building for rent that the landlords would not rent will be converted and these 40,000 new tenants will all have loft like condos. That is what people want these days, loft like condos. With development like this you can expect the building of a multiplex. It is sad in a way that Williamsburg will now be like parkslope, or modeled after Battery Park City, Jersey City or Hoboken. The area East of the BQE will untouched because it is already zoned for residential, the area around the Lorimer and Graham stops. I am sure now, with this kind construction we will once again have a movie theater, maybe even a multiplex. The Commodore is gone for good it seems, and soon we might have a theater that will not have rumbling trains going by from the EL. I believe the kind of multiplex will be like the Kaufman Astoria multiplex in Astoria.
Do some this is bad news, to others good. I have mix feeling about this. I believe building parkland on the waterfront and now allowing conversion of all the industrial buildings to residential will beautify the neighborhood. It would be nice to have an esplanade that the governor and the mayor want to stretch from Greenpoint to Bayride. However, Williamsburg does not need a 40 story building, and two is too much. It seems those buildings are to be modeled after that giant building in Long Island City that we can see in the skyline near the other tall building in Long Island City, the Citibank building.
Rezoning areas like Williamsburg have been a mandate for Bloomberg. By rezoning, his people believe it will beautify neighborhoods, from Billburg to Redhook. Even Brooklyn Heights which already has the beautiful promenade will once again have access to the waterfront as the abandoned docks below the promenade will be turned into parkland.
I know some are you against the Yuppifying of Williamsburg, and now with Barnes and Noble, Old Navy and possibly a multiplex will more than likely bring what we all think as the ultimate evil, Starbucks. The Williamsburg Warrior group tried to stop this and even protested. But the fight is over. On May 11th the city council voted for rezoning that land owners from the those in small houses to big warehouse owners have fought for. Even the Communnity Board to a point contributed to this rezoning when the threat of a power plant coming to the waterfront, they sent recommendations and their own studies of rezoning to the City as the plan 197a. There is even animation and models online for all to look at which I will post below.
I am very sad about the Commodore because I did try to save it as you can see from my past posts and even talked to the Katherine Oliver the film commissioner about making it a landmark. But as we thought and dreamed about the Commodore, maybe we should have looked more at the big picture.
The one thing I all want you to consider though is what past industry before more strict dumping laws came into affect. Within the last six months, when rezoning was being debated I cut out an article with a map of the burg and Greenpoint. This map got me very upset. My mother was born at the former Wiliamsburg Maternity Hospital on Humboldt and Baptize at the Ukranian Catholic Church on North 6th Street. To me coming back to burg, was a “return” because this area was the place my Grandparents moved to after living briefly in Pennsylvannia to pursue the American dream. This inspired me to live here, and remain here, hope to buy a house eventually, and raise a family here. I attended NYU in the early 1990’s and lived in the East Village when it was still a war zone, and was part of the crowd to gentrify it. After college I moved to Los Angeles for 5 years to get my masters from UCLA. I returned and was very upset that the area no one wanted to live in , that I took a chance on, was no longer affordable, and young artist and young people started out were pushed into the sea. I was happy though to be part of the people gentrifying Williamsburg and vowed never to leave the neighborhood, I “helped to rebuild” However this map in the Post was shocking. And upfront I would like to say it was not a right wing attempt to push through rezoning because of the Post’s politics. My area, the one where I had roots from 60 years ago and now wanted to live and raise an family, is badly contaminated, especially the most expensive section the Northside. Because the area was working class, and then minorities without political clout, company’s began dumping toxic and harmful chemicals, in their basements and illegally dumping in empty lots in the neighborhood. These companies have left, but there damage remains.
The empty lot on North 12th and Bedford, has been empty for as long as I have lived in the burg, 6 years. I asked many people why, and few could say, because they were also new residence. I finally investigated on my own, searching through the library and asking older residence. That empty lot was a paint factory, and full of toxic waste. That is why not only is it an empty lot but also locked and chained up. The plan for that empty lot which we all most know is valuable land, right on the main drag of Bedford Ave and next to the park was suppose to become a shopping center that would included a small multiplex or at least a new movie theater. A theater similar to the Angelika I was told, but the rumor about the movie theater is hearsay. But what I did find out is the reason it has remained idle is a legal battle over who should clean up the hazardous waste, the former owners or the new owners. Cleaning up this waste is expensive with the workers needing to wear protective clothing and gloves similar to those used by workers who clean asbestos another lie we were told just like the hazardous waste. What gets me is, if this stuff is dangerous, and the land of the northside contaminated, why will workers touching that soil be protected, but yet, anyone walking around Bedford Ave is not even notified of the hazards. I am sure on a hot and humid summer day, pedestrians wearing very little clothing such as t-shirts, shorts and sandals, walk by the site all the time, probably being exposed to it, as the hot humid day might even cause the hazardous waste seep upwards. Or even think about this, wearing you summer attire and playing ball across the street and rolling around in the soil and grass of McCarren Park or the dogs digging and sniffing in the Dog Run on North 12 and Driggs near by, rolling around, digging, and possibly ingesting soil.
This is not the only area as this Post indicated. All over the Northside is toxic waste dumped into the ground. The N 12th empty lot is right next to McCarren Park. How much toxic waste has seeped in there where we play ball, our dogs play in the dog run nearby and our children or soon to be children will play. This map was such an eye opener that if something did not change or get cleaned up, Williamsburg which I love, and have roots in dating back 60 years, is not a place I want to raise children, have my dog play, or even play ball. Luckily, I live near the Lorimer stop, which was always residential, and very few industry, so at least at the present time, where I live is not affected. But it is not a big enough place to raise a family and even if it were, I am sure my kids would have friends on the the Northside. How could I endanger them by allowing them to play over there without knowing where they are playing or how badly the toxic waste and pollution have spread because the dumping begain 40 years ago. Even thinking about it now, I am sure my kids would think I am horrible dad for not letting them play with their friends in the neighborhood.
Although I am not happy with 40 story building and some of the plan of redevelopment, I am very happy the city council passed the plan and the immediate rezoning and redevelopment will begin ASAP. Why? Because as part of the plan, the toxic and hazardous waste will be required to be cleaned and the city would assist with money to do so. Which ever place you stand or rezoning and redevelopment, no one liberal, conservative, activist, silent majority, whatever label you might consider yourself should have themselves or their families whether living now or future plans be exposed to the mess of big business. Who knows, I had a friend who had a small vegetable garden in her backyard on the Northside and would often give me things from her garden. I did tell her about the possible hazards of the soil, but she did not take me seriously. But to not to be inpolite on a few occasions, I accepted some veggies from her garden, which I immediately threw out. Not only have we all be exposed, but, the though of eating from gardens in the burg is unsettling. For those of you wanting families in the future and staying in the burg, could the current problem become a problem for the health of our future offspring, not living in the area I am talking development in the womb. I do not buy the argument that was in a local paper when a baby store opened on Bedford Ave that one young resident stated, “If you want to have kids, you should move to Park Slope.” If you agree or disagree about this statement, either way, you should be allowed to have a family anywhere, without fear of some ignorant 20 year old, but have exposure to toxins.
So to conclude this view on getting a movie theater in the Burg. It looks like with a redevelopment like this, no company like UA, Loews, Clearview or AMC, would allow redevelopment in an area with young, educated and cultured people pass them by. As far as chains like Old Navy or Barne and Noble, I honestly believe that a movie theater company if one but all, would bid to build a multiplex and could lead to the Burg/Greenpoint once again having just as many screens as it did in the glory days when single screen theaters were the standard. It is unfortunate, the Commodore cannot be saved or every other theater in the 11211 area that closed over the past 20 years. But one thing is for sure, no matter how many screens we have, at least we can live in the burg knowing, our health is not in danger.
Here is the animation section of the City Planning Commission rendition of what the Northside will look like from different “drives” through the rezoning area. For those of you like me who love the burg now, this can be shocking to see so prepare yourself because the debate has passed and the City has approved the rezoning. So there is very little to be done. The one thing that most on the City Council agreed upon was that if the waterfront was not rezoned, more than likely, a power plant or a “Garbage Station” would once again be considered for the burg and probably pass. To the City Council and local leaders this was their only chance to clean up the waste, and save the burg and Greenpoint from any talk of a power plant or a “garbage station” Without rezoning these two environmental evils would be put back on table and this time, no matter how protested, it would not be defeated again.
So below are the plans for the Burg, with the Animaton link first. I know some of you might find this upsetting, but please, I am onl y the messenger.
Animation of the Waterfront-
View link
The entire plan and proposal approved by the City:
View link
And finally the website of the “Williamsburg Warriors” who should be commended for putting up a good fight and organizing protests and petitions. Though I believe there link for sigining a petition is outdated. They have very good links to websites such as Marty M’s proposed changes to the plans, such as rejection of the 40 story Building.
www.williamsburgwarriors.org
I hope you all agree with me that the Commodore is a tragedy. But at least a mulitplex might be better than nothing. And again, I am just informing you all that such a theater is rumored to be in works. So please, don’t shoot the messenger!
Thanks for all you responses, but honestly, I have seen theaters like this that were quaded and yes they mixed mordern walls the beauty, but that is more done to keep the original beauty intct. RCDTJ, said he thanks god it closed before they could butched it. I disagree. I would rather have a quad theater with artifacts of the past, that if the day should come to open as a vaudvile theater or such, the walls can be taken down. Working in film, tv and stage, I even seen theaters that movie theaters with a wall down the middle and when a stage show was done, the wall actually folded up.
Yes parking was a problem with all of these, but I’d rather of my old Floral in some form, with its beauty on one wall that I sit in rather than no Floral at all. Ditto for the Calderone.
If you disagree, I just want to remind you of the Landmark Sunshine Theater on Houston Street. When I lived downtown around there at NYU, when the East Village was becoming trendy but the lower eastside still was scary after dark, I remember in the day going to Schimmels and remember the warehouse next store. Who knew when the things are wiped away and restored, that old warehouse was the old yiddish playhouse! Just because they would use modern walls the quad it, the Sunshine goes to show you, sometimes not destroying and waiting for a “theaters” time again to rise, restoring the Floral is better than the present day office building and catering hall.
I miss the Floral and would have taken a quaded one anyday over closing forever and more or less butchering the theater when it moves to another use.
As for
Hands down, in Nassau, the Floral was one of the most beautful theaters in the county. How is was not landmarked it was a mystey to me. Supposedly, it was one of Long Island premiere movies houses, and when I say premiere, I mean, cast members, while promoting the movie in New York would come to the Floral because of the beauty and the way the theater was set up. When it closed I remember an article in Newsday, that I think are the Long Island opening of Mildred Pierce, Joan Crawford, came out on the stage when either before it started or ended. The unfortunate thing now, is that people in this area are stuck either going to the Clearview Theaters like the Herricks and Franklin Square which are pretty good, but nothing like the Floral. The Floral showed all the great movies, I remember, my 11th birthday, my parents took 10 friends of mine and me to see Return of The Jedi, which is the last movie I remember seeing there in 1983. And then it close for quading that never happened. This theater was so beautiful, that even quading it would have been a shame. It did look like it are one time was Nassau Counties, Radio City Music Hall. I do remember the balcony always being closed, except of course for movies like Jedi, when they needed the space. But they even had boxes if I remember correctly on the side like Radio City and other fancy theaters. They were never opened, but that is the kind of theater we are talking about.
The area around the Floral as I said has only three options the Herricks and the Franklin Six which both were single theaters divided so much, that on a busy first weekend Friday and Satuday night you are better going to the raceway because you will never get a ticket. But quading the Floral, really would have been the only way for it to survive, because this theater was huge, and even Jedi, once the balcony opened, was still not sold out. Imagine today, the new Star Wars plays on the six screens, the Floral could hold that capacity in its one theater.
In my opinion what killed the Floral and not quading, was parking, parking, parking. The Floral was built at a time when the movie theater was like the communnity entertainment center in the days before tv, but by the mid 1980’s, Everyone drove there. Well you can imagine a theater with 1654 seats, even quaded, where do you park the car? It still was a busy merchant street, and there was one municipal lot that with a generous estimate, 50 cars! How can you have a theater that big and so few parking spaces. I remember, the streets around it had one hour parking, so side street parking was out of the question. I hope the owners attempted to have a garge built somewhere turn the small parking lot into multi level lot. I am sure, someone with a theater like that would have done anything to keep it open if they were going to quad it. But parking is what killed the beauty, just like when live in Los Angeles, they would knocked down old homes that were almost historic, and buidlings from the old hollywood of the 30’s and 40’s to make parking. That area just had no room for parking except that small lot. And the community was not helping but now allowing sreet parking. So that is how a beauty like the Floral died and Franklin Sq and Herricks are the only game in town beside the mall area. Parking. The Herricks has its own parking lot. And across Hempstead Tpk, the Franklin Sq theaters as two huge public town lots used on Sunday mornings for the hundreds of parishoners of St Catherines around the corner and during the week and rest of the weekend, the movie theater as free parking for any one, in the village park lot with no meters. So even when the FS theater is sold out as it frequently is with small theaters, the lots are never filled to capacity.
Again, though I spent much of teens at the Herrick and the Franklin to see movies, it is just heartbreaking to see a theater like the Floral be destroyed by PARKING! To me, that is a sin, and the community should have done something save the building including landmarking it. But now it is gone, and will never return. Another case where “they took an idol and smashed it!”