NY Projectionists: Licensed by fire departments?

You pose an interesting question. I am out here in Kansas, and I can tell you this much, that the fire threat in the projection booth diminished with the advent of xenon bulbs and fire retardant film, which melts instead of burns, ( I dont know the technical name for it.) The great theatre fires were started from the curtains, seats and generally in the projection booths when film caught on fire and set everything else off. I used to have a projectionist who could tell the story about just getting out of a booth before the fire doors locked on him. However, you do also make a good point, that the art of projecting a motion picture is, and has become a lost art. There are fewer and fewer ‘moving picture machine operators’ left in this world. The concept of pride in ones craft and the motovating influence to instill that pride is becoming fewer and fewer, but if you can find a theatre where that pride is exemplified, by all means patronize the place, and frequently, and let the management know you appreciate their efforts, sometimes they need to know.

The regular projectionists licenses are handled by the New York City Department of Consumer Affairs.

It is an old law for the city of New York. Just like you have to have a license to operate a news stand, sell cigarettes and you even have to have a permit to go out of business.
This is not a union thing. Most of the operators are having their hours cut.

Welcome to the Big Apple.

The test was never really very difficult, just badly outdated, badly written and controlled by the union. It DID have questions about nitrate film well into the eighties and some of the questions didn’t even make sense.

In my opinion, the union lost it’s footing by backing the continued employment of incompetent projectionists with a history of poor performance and at premium rates. The cinema chains in financial trouble had nothing to lose by playing hardball because the professionals were so few. The notoriously lazy cinema operators would have kept the status quo if more of the projectionists did their jobs, or at least showed up on time, and the union had helped replace the bad ones instead of insisting they kept their jobs in spite of gross negligence.

Today the test costs around $200 dollars to take and $75.00 to renew every two years for the city of New York.

Pretty good i guess, owning 9 theaters in the south i never even knew,,,and we hire projectionist at good rates but not union i would think

I was a union projectionist for 12 years. I put on the finest show possible. Showmanship showed in everything I did, from the cleanliness of the projection room, and equipment to the opening of the curtain, the changeovers were flawlessly made, and the equipment was maintained to the letter. Unfortunately we went by the “seniority system”, and a lot of slackers that had been around for a long time got the better theatres. As automation set in, many could not “get it”, and many shows were lost due to incompetence. There were also MANY archaic items in the union contracts that definitely did not coincide with the times. Attitudes were poor, tension between management was high, dirty tricks abounded at contract time. We were seen more as a liability than an asset. Our local disbanded in the late 80s. What was once an honorable trade has has become a job for the high school kid. Newer automation has made the job easy, and kids that are the age of ushers often run megaplex projection rooms now. I see parllels in the aut industry too. They are running themselves out of their jobs too, just as the projectionist locals did.

I remember in South Florida when the Union demanded such high hourly rates that many theatres shut down matinees. This caused the elimination of many full time jobs and, of course, the professional projectionists who did them, who instead moved into other professions. A very stupid negotiation that ended up hurting everyone.

The first sentence I forgot to add “afew dollars more per screen locations.”

Alavarez, I wonder if you are a bit confused, the prints we use today, and have for a while now, are made up on mylar stock which is very durable.
Prints are hard to break (tear)and do not scratch as easily as they did in the past when safety film stock was in use.
In the old days we had a lot of problems with broken (stripped)or torn sprocket holes but since mylar was introduced the print damage has decreased considerably. The one down side of mylar is that it may be too tough, now if a print jams it does not break and can cause damage to gears and other parts of a projector.
Try it for yourself, take a strip of mylar and try and tear it with your bare hands, you will not be able to do it. Then if you can find a piece of safety stock you will find you will be able to tear it easily.

The one down side of mylar is that it may be too tough, now if a print jams it does not break and can cause damage to gears and other parts of a projector

True and as I remember it prints made of mylar was also made thinner than regular cellulose-acetate prints. I often had to adjust the gate pressure when I went to mylar to help keep the clattering noise down and the picture steady. Also you cannot use a cement (wet) splicer on mylar prints.

Al, I am shocked to read about the problems you are encountering.
In all the years I spent in the booth (post mylar) I never heard of the problems you write about. Soundtracks cracking after a week?
I have run many prints on a platter for up to 8 weeks without a problem. I wonder if any one else can explain what the heck is going on with our prints in Europe.
Denny, true about the wet splicing, fortunatly however, I don’t think to many folks are still splicing that way. One fact remains, mylar is tough on projection equipment.
Also the testing both written and practical you described is very much the way it was in NY back in the day.
On Long Island, where a licence is not needed, practical tests used to given by the union before one can start work there. I am not sure if that is still required, one would imagine so.

William, I wondered how long it would be before they stopped putting our beloved cue marks on prints. I shall miss em.I wonder if
reel-to-reel houses (the few left)can still buy cue scribers.

Note to TommyR, I hope you will forgive us for some of the off topic discussions contained in your thread.

It seems the last minute rush jobs on blockbusters are the worse, with wet prints, sloppy lab splices and flaking from day one. These labs are digital’s best friend.

i own a q marker and splicer Aw single reels i remember spending Min’s before a show start in the booth putting the first reel on then i converted to full reels holding 3 single and then i moved to platters wow! no more need for projectionist so i became theatre manager operator

After learning the projection craft with my cousin, and passing the City of New York exam, I opted to work closer to home (Yonkers, NY).

In 1982, the NYC Moving Picture Operator’s License exam was given by the Department of Water Supply, Gas & Electricity. The written exam was 100 multiple choice questions. The practical exam was given in the basement of one of the municipal buildings in lower Manhattan. As I recall, the inspectors tested us quite thoroughly with regard to installation, troubleshooting and proper projection practices with regard to handling nitrate film.

I had a Moving Picture Operator’s licenses in New Rochelle, Yonkers, Mount Vernon, Greenburgh, Port Chester, and White Plains. All were issued by the Fire Department.

When I worked at the Parkway Theater in Mount Vernon, the Fire Inspector would pay a visit every evening. Typically they would take my name, license number, and film footage. New Rochelle would inspect every Friday night, and Saturday afternoon. Yonkers was every Saturday afternoon. The rest were random.

Indeed, Local 650 MPMO (IATSE) located in the Bar Building in Mount Vernon, was quite a strong local until the 1990’s. By then, most of the operators had 2nd jobs and didn’t treat the craft as the profession it once was. Those that did, remained working in the industry either in Local 306 (NYC) or post production.

I “Broomed” (apprenticed) under a union projectionist who paid his dues for fifty-five years in 1970. He died in 1972 or so and the Union did not even send him a flower or a card. Is there any wonder why they lost their significance or influence. Of course as a result of the failure to maintain any standards for projectionists, booths are dirty, film trains are dirty and causing “rain” streaks on film, absolutely bad splices are made, Xenon lamphouses and lamps are handled very carelessly and dangerously and dozens of other faults that cause the deteriorization of the customers motion picture experience continue — and box office profits are reduced. I’ve handled carbon arc and xenon lamps in my time and I can guarantee that the hot xenon bulb is extremely dangerous yet you go into booths that don’t even provide face masks or instruction on the removal and replacement of the bulb to the new projectionist.

In any case the competency of the projectionist is important but ignored in a suffering and often suicidal industry.

I was a Local 306 member in NYC back in the 1970’s. I, as all of the other projectionists I knew and associated with, took great pride in my work. The license requirement in NYC ensured that all operators had at least a basic understanding of the mechanical and electrical functions of the equipment. All of the theaters I worked in the city had service contracts, and the theater owners were adamant about daily maintenance of the booths and projection equipment. As a result, the quality of projection was very high, and allowed for ever higher contracted wages for the projectionists. A few years back I found myself between jobs and took a position as a manager at the Carmel Movieplex 8 in Carmel, NY. My projection background was key to landing this job, and my number 1 challenge was projection. The staff were mostly minimally trained high school students. They were taught how to thread-up a projector, and push the show-start button. They were paid not much more than the concession stand workers and could not even put a show together. There was no service contract. The company that owned the theater owned 12 other theaters spread out across New York State, Connecticut, Mass,and Vermont, with 1 service person headquartered in Vermont. The “philosophy” of this company and most modern multiplexes is to have the management staff cover projection duties as much as possible. Why not? They’re salaried employees. Anyone who has ever managed a theater knows the impracticality of this, as the manager is required to deal with public relations, facility maintenance, housekeeping, staffing, payroll, purchasing, inventory, and various other responsibilities too nemerous to mention. While my experience enabled me to train and assist the projection staff, it was not logistically possible to cover projection shifts on any but the quietest of midweek shifts when less than 8 theaters had shows running. Without a service contract, and with infrequent overhauling of the projection equipment, there were numerous breakdowns, and shows often had to be cancelled. The big chains train their managers to be projectionists to get around the unions, but they know where their bread is buttered and keep the projection equipment in tip-top shape. Routine maintenance is key, but projectionists need training and should be paid a salary comensurate with the responsibilities of the position. A state license requirement might help, but the theater owners would fight it tooth and nail. If a concession stand worker doesn’t show up for work, the line at the concession stand may be a little longer. If the projectionist doesn’t show up, there’s no show.

Yes, there were many slackers in 306 taking advantage of their fellow workers, as there are in every union. It is an inherent problem with unions; whether you work hard and try to excel, or you do the minimum and ride on the backs of others, everyone gets equalized. It is not really compatible with our free market economy; work hard and succeed; slack off and fall behind. My point, and I know I’m guilty of straying from it at times, is that some sort of regulation or liscensing for projectionists is a good thing. Another point I failed to address in my previous posting is with regard to licensing by fire departments. In NYC back in the 1970’s, many, if not most theaters were still using fuses in their main electrical panels. Many of them actually had nails bridging those fuses in clear violation of all city fire codes, electrical codes, and just plain common sense. Yet every theater had it’s duly signed and posted fire safety inspection certificate right there in the booth for all to see. There was obviously corruption going on at the expense of public safety. Bringing these types of issues up for discussion at union meetings was not in one’s best interest.

Although I am only 49 years old, I have been a UNION projectionist for almost 33 years. (3 appentice, stated out doing summer matinees in 1975,and 30 as a full member.) I have worked in many theatres over the tears, from 1 to 18 screens. My father was a UNION projectionist for 55 years, before passing on to that big movie palace in the heavens. I remember when he needed a license to project in Perth Amboy N.J. Everyone above makes points that are all true. We had losers in our old local 379, but more so we had many, many good people who really cared, including myself. I really miss the old days of carbon arc and 20 minute reels. (Thankfully for me, they may actually return, as I am involved with restoring the projection room at the Ritz Theatre in Elizabeth, N.J.) It is not surprising however to see what has happened over the years. In the old days, (pre 1970) a lot of theatres were private owners with one screen. You needed a trained professional to run the equipment, especially with nitrate film (the burnable film). As safety film (the stuff used today) came in being, along with the now dreaded multiplex, a trained professional became expendable. The attitude of most of the big chains was, “well if we lose one screen, we have others.” Why do you think even today, look at the big theatres, they always have 1 or 2 older movies playing. All of the above, along with the huge influx of 3 month DVD releasing makes quality projection less and less important. As I posted elsewhere here on Cinema Treasures, just wait until digital cinema comes along, some of these manager-operators are going to find out what us hard working union guys have been going thru these past 25 years.

Don’t forget your very own so called Union Brothers, I worked allot of union jobs and many times had to go in extra early and really go over the booth with a fine tooth comb.. The older ones would take out a fuse and put a piece of cardboard behind it so you would have no power and they would come in and save the day.This tactic never worked with me, I was always taught by my Uncle to check everything. He was a retired union man.. The joy of calling them at home to tell them not to come in because you found the carboard was great, the thud of the phone hanging up. So it was not just theatre owners it was everyone even our own.

JGA, you might want to go to N.Dimaggio’s site he is from That area and knows one living projectionist still in the Tampa area,He might be able to help.